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Re: Enough is Enough Rallies
Posted: Sat Oct 01, 2022 2:27 pm
by Bird on a Fire
headshot wrote: ↑Sat Oct 01, 2022 2:14 pm
Bird on a Fire wrote: ↑Sat Oct 01, 2022 2:01 pm
For sure. So it's good that these events whose organisers have sensible objectives enjoy mainstream support, despite the appearance of some annoying tw.ts.
Otherwise it's like letting a few stupid anarchists hijack the BLM campaign.
I'm saying don't write off the whole movement because of what appears to be a noisy unpleasant minority. It's good that people have turned up to this, and it would be bad if they were put off by some a..holes.
I’m not writing the whole thing off. I was there after all, and it was a decent-ish turnout. Probably 300-400 people. Lots of good points made by the speakers (the CWU guy was particaulrly good) - even if each of them basically said the same thing every time.
There were three large banners for the unions. I’m very supportive of their presence. Frau HS is the Secretary for her branch of the UCU.
BUT…the majority of placards and banners as you walked up to the event were SWP, Stop the War, Pro-Assange (!) and other leftist causes.
As I said, the Gaza “End the siege” placards surrounded the entire space. It looked like an anti-war demo, not one with which almost every passer-by would associate with, or feel compassion for.
It was alienating and clearly gave people the wrong idea.
People need to be encouraged to join protests like this, and to feel comfortable being there - from all parts of the political spectrum. Chanting “Tory Scum” is just dumb, when you could shout “No more cuts” or “Liz Truss Out” or whatever.
It’s playground politics writ large.
Fair enough. Sorry if I sounded like I was having a go.
It does sound like an organisational issue, if people approaching from other angles wouldn't know what it's about.
Part of the issue, I expect, is that in general protests and demonstrations in the UK have been done by rather extreme groups (exceptions being the anti-Iraq and anti-Brexit marches). As a result, those groups already have well-developed tactics for getting their message out at an event. The organisers of newer movements have a fair bit of learning to do I expect. Might even be worth dropping them a line to say "Next time, make sure the folk at the periphery are on-message too."
Re: Enough is Enough Rallies
Posted: Sun Oct 02, 2022 1:05 am
by Millennie Al
Really? I have looked at those four pictures and see these signs:
UCU Defending Higher education
Vote yes on 7.9.22
shirt - obscured
There is so much sh.t to protest about I couldn't even decide what to write on this sign
XR symbol in background
RMT
--------- NOW (unreadable)
F**H THE TORIES
Birmingham trades council
UCU
RMT
Tax the rich
CUT WA-- NO--
PROUD TO BE ---
UCU
Birmingham trades council
UCU
So if I wasn't told what it was about, or couldn't guess from the news, I would have no idea.
Re: Enough is Enough Rallies
Posted: Sun Oct 02, 2022 5:02 am
by plodder
discovolante wrote: ↑Sat Oct 01, 2022 1:37 pm
The SWP turn up to every rally going, it's pretty much unavoidable and the fewer non-SWP people are there the more the SWP will dominate.
More than that, they help organise the demos, arrange coach loads of attendees, they fundraise, they hand out the placards, they organise the speakers etc. they are absolutely insidious, have their claws into the wider Labour movement and have done for decades and I wouldn’t be surprised if their funding streams made your toes curl. Dreadful tossers, crowding sensible people out, and almost certainly reporting to MI5.
Re: Enough is Enough Rallies
Posted: Sun Oct 02, 2022 3:48 pm
by Martin Y
Millennie Al wrote: ↑Sun Oct 02, 2022 1:05 am
Bird on a Fire wrote: ↑Sat Oct 01, 2022 1:21 pm
Wider crowd shots, rather than a couple of cherry-picked individuals, make it pretty clear what the demo's for ...
Really? I have looked at those four pictures and [snip] if I wasn't told what it was about, or couldn't guess from the news, I would have no idea.
I have to agree. Those pictures didn't tell me what they were there to protest about. Imagine coming back to those photos some time in the future, not knowing when they were taken and devoid of context. f.ck knows what the demo was for and which placards were just hangers-on with their own pet issue.
Re: Enough is Enough Rallies
Posted: Sun Oct 02, 2022 4:00 pm
by discovolante
Bird on a Fire wrote: ↑Sat Oct 01, 2022 2:01 pm
For sure. So it's good that these events whose organisers have sensible objectives enjoy mainstream support, despite the appearance of some annoying tw.ts.
Otherwise it's like letting a few stupid anarchists hijack the BLM campaign.
I'm saying don't write off the whole movement because of what appears to be a noisy unpleasant minority. It's good that people have turned up to this, and it would be bad if they were put off by some a..holes.
I happened to be in London when the demo for Chris Kaba took place so we headed over and took party. At one point I realised I was walking next to a 'free Assange' banner...I dunno what Chris Kaba's family think about that subject but regardless it seemed a bit gross tbh. Although given Sky news mistook the march for a parade of people on their way to pay their respects to the queen, it's sort of disappointing that the helicopter filming the demo didn't zoom in on the banner at that particular moment.
Enough is Enough could introduce some rules about banners I suppose, but that would probably be quite tricky to implement in practice.
Re: Enough is Enough Rallies
Posted: Tue Oct 04, 2022 8:51 am
by philbo
headshot wrote: ↑Sat Oct 01, 2022 2:14 pm
People need to be encouraged to join protests like this, and to feel comfortable being there - from all parts of the political spectrum. Chanting “Tory Scum” is just dumb, when you could shout “No more cuts” or “Liz Truss Out” or whatever.
It’s playground politics writ large.
Agreed, though I think you left the "n" out of one of those things you could shout
Re: Enough is Enough Rallies
Posted: Tue Oct 04, 2022 10:24 am
by Bird on a Fire
philbo wrote: ↑Tue Oct 04, 2022 8:51 am
headshot wrote: ↑Sat Oct 01, 2022 2:14 pm
People need to be encouraged to join protests like this, and to feel comfortable being there - from all parts of the political spectrum. Chanting “Tory Scum” is just dumb, when you could shout “No more cuts” or “Liz Truss Out” or whatever.
It’s playground politics writ large.
Agreed, though I think you left the "n" out of one of those things you could shout
Very divisive. You might put c.nts off supporting the demo
Re: Enough is Enough Rallies
Posted: Wed Oct 05, 2022 6:25 am
by headshot
Bird on a Fire wrote: ↑Tue Oct 04, 2022 10:24 am
philbo wrote: ↑Tue Oct 04, 2022 8:51 am
headshot wrote: ↑Sat Oct 01, 2022 2:14 pm
People need to be encouraged to join protests like this, and to feel comfortable being there - from all parts of the political spectrum. Chanting “Tory Scum” is just dumb, when you could shout “No more cuts” or “Liz Truss Out” or whatever.
It’s playground politics writ large.
Agreed, though I think you left the "n" out of one of those things you could shout
Very divisive. You might put c.nts off supporting the demo
It didn’t seem to.
Re: Enough is Enough Rallies
Posted: Wed Oct 05, 2022 5:44 pm
by Stranger Mouse
headshot wrote: ↑Sat Oct 01, 2022 2:14 pm
Bird on a Fire wrote: ↑Sat Oct 01, 2022 2:01 pm
For sure. So it's good that these events whose organisers have sensible objectives enjoy mainstream support, despite the appearance of some annoying tw.ts.
Otherwise it's like letting a few stupid anarchists hijack the BLM campaign.
I'm saying don't write off the whole movement because of what appears to be a noisy unpleasant minority. It's good that people have turned up to this, and it would be bad if they were put off by some a..holes.
I’m not writing the whole thing off. I was there after all, and it was a decent-ish turnout. Probably 300-400 people. Lots of good points made by the speakers (the CWU guy was particaulrly good) - even if each of them basically said the same thing every time.
There were three large banners for the unions. I’m very supportive of their presence. Frau HS is the Secretary for her branch of the UCU.
BUT…the majority of placards and banners as you walked up to the event were SWP, Stop the War, Pro-Assange (!) and other leftist causes.
As I said, the Gaza “End the siege” placards surrounded the entire space. It looked like an anti-war demo, not one with which almost every passer-by would associate with, or feel compassion for.
It was alienating and clearly gave people the wrong idea.
People need to be encouraged to join protests like this, and to feel comfortable being there - from all parts of the political spectrum. Chanting “Tory Scum” is just dumb, when you could shout “No more cuts” or “Liz Truss Out” or whatever.
It’s playground politics writ large.
We’re there any updates on the number of people who would ever kiss a Tory?
