Scrutable

« L’éolien en mer peut produire en masse une électricité à bas coût, à proximité des centres de consommation »

S’appuyant sur le dernier rapport de l’Agence internationale de l’énergie, le spécialiste du climat Stéphane His explique, dans une tribune au « Monde », que l’éolien maritime présente le bouquet énergétique décarboné le plus efficient.

Tribune. Devenu l’un des marchés les plus dynamiques du secteur des énergies renouvelables, l’éolien en mer a vocation à devenir une technologie de référence dans le domaine énergétique. Le dernier rapport de l’Agence internationale de l’énergie (AIE) souligne le potentiel « quasi illimité » d’un secteur porté par une croissance annuelle de près de 20 % et dont les coûts de production sont en chute...

bmforre wrote: ↑

Wed Nov 13, 2019 1:35 am

Building windmills have virtually stopped in Germany because it's politically very difficult to get power from North where offshore wind is generated to South where factories need more. Reason: Environmentalists strongly oppose above-ground power lines.

Here in Norway we meet similar problems and most environmentalists don't understand and respect the technical challenges involved. They chant against "Monster-masts" and this popular slogan trumps the need to transmit power to where it's required.

Ongoing German debate on these matters is interesting and important. I follow such debate mainly on the Frankfurter Allgemeine and 3sat TV but that's exclusively in German. Der Spiegel may have material in English?

Grumble wrote: ↑

Wed Nov 13, 2019 6:30 am

bmforre wrote: ↑

Wed Nov 13, 2019 1:35 am

Building windmills have virtually stopped in Germany because it's politically very difficult to get power from North where offshore wind is generated to South where factories need more. Reason: Environmentalists strongly oppose above-ground power lines.

Here in Norway we meet similar problems and most environmentalists don't understand and respect the technical challenges involved. They chant against "Monster-masts" and this popular slogan trumps the need to transmit power to where it's required.

Ongoing German debate on these matters is interesting and important. I follow such debate mainly on the Frankfurter Allgemeine and 3sat TV but that's exclusively in German. Der Spiegel may have material in English?

I understand there’s a visual impact, but what are the environmental concerns about transmission lines?

bjn wrote: ↑

Tue Nov 12, 2019 11:50 pm

Outside of the nut job coal miner suck-ups running Australia at the moment, it's a pretty standard position that coal's days are numbered. Renewables are continuing to dive in price. This has destroyed the economic viability of coal. In many locations it is now cheaper to build and operate new wind and solar farms than to simply fuel a fully paid off coal plant. You are seeing the consequences of this in places such as Texas where nary a coal plant is in the planning pipeline, there's a bit of gas generation but tens of gigawatts of wind and solar.

Oils is the next one to look down the barrel of the gun. BNP Paribas did an analysis as to the long term viability of oil. It will need to sell below $10/barrel for petrol to be cost competitive with renewable powered battery electric vehicles. Diesel gets away with about $20/barrel.

They had some interesting figures for the metric Energy Return on Capital Invested (EROCI). For the same capital outlay, today, renewables generate 5-6 times as much energy at the wheel of a BEV than does the equivalent capital invested in oil powering an ICE. That ratio is only going to swing more and more into renewables favour as they drop in price and oil reserves dwindle.

The article gives oil a 15-20 year window and only their incumbency is allowing them to tick on. Oil is as f.cked as coal, just with a slightly longer lead time.

jimbob wrote: ↑

Wed Nov 13, 2019 8:20 am

Grumble wrote: ↑

Wed Nov 13, 2019 6:30 am

bmforre wrote: ↑

Wed Nov 13, 2019 1:35 am

Building windmills have virtually stopped in Germany because it's politically very difficult to get power from North where offshore wind is generated to South where factories need more. Reason: Environmentalists strongly oppose above-ground power lines.

Here in Norway we meet similar problems and most environmentalists don't understand and respect the technical challenges involved. They chant against "Monster-masts" and this popular slogan trumps the need to transmit power to where it's required.

Ongoing German debate on these matters is interesting and important. I follow such debate mainly on the Frankfurter Allgemeine and 3sat TV but that's exclusively in German. Der Spiegel may have material in English?

I understand there’s a visual impact, but what are the environmental concerns about transmission lines?

Oh god, I bet it's the whole EM sensitivity and radiation rubbish

Bird on a Fire wrote: ↑

Wed Nov 13, 2019 11:29 am

... Obviously this has to be weighed against the negative impacts of climate change, coal mining etcetera, which is by no means straightforward. But please don't just dismiss environmentalists as a load of woolly-brained idiots before doing any research whatsoever ...

jimbob wrote: ↑

Wed Nov 13, 2019 8:20 am

Grumble wrote: ↑

Wed Nov 13, 2019 6:30 am

bmforre wrote: ↑

Wed Nov 13, 2019 1:35 am

Building windmills have virtually stopped in Germany because it's politically very difficult to get power from North where offshore wind is generated to South where factories need more. Reason: Environmentalists strongly oppose above-ground power lines.

Here in Norway we meet similar problems and most environmentalists don't understand and respect the technical challenges involved. They chant against "Monster-masts" and this popular slogan trumps the need to transmit power to where it's required.

Ongoing German debate on these matters is interesting and important. I follow such debate mainly on the Frankfurter Allgemeine and 3sat TV but that's exclusively in German. Der Spiegel may have material in English?

I understand there’s a visual impact, but what are the environmental concerns about transmission lines?

Oh god, I bet it's the whole EM sensitivity and radiation rubbish

jimbob wrote: ↑

Wed Nov 13, 2019 8:20 am

Grumble wrote: ↑

Wed Nov 13, 2019 6:30 am

bmforre wrote: ↑

Wed Nov 13, 2019 1:35 am

Building windmills have virtually stopped in Germany because it's politically very difficult to get power from North where offshore wind is generated to South where factories need more. Reason: Environmentalists strongly oppose above-ground power lines.

Here in Norway we meet similar problems and most environmentalists don't understand and respect the technical challenges involved. They chant against "Monster-masts" and this popular slogan trumps the need to transmit power to where it's required.

Ongoing German debate on these matters is interesting and important. I follow such debate mainly on the Frankfurter Allgemeine and 3sat TV but that's exclusively in German. Der Spiegel may have material in English?

I understand there’s a visual impact, but what are the environmental concerns about transmission lines?

Oh god, I bet it's the whole EM sensitivity and radiation rubbish

Bird on a Fire wrote: ↑

Wed Nov 13, 2019 11:29 am

jimbob wrote: ↑

Wed Nov 13, 2019 8:20 am

Grumble wrote: ↑

Wed Nov 13, 2019 6:30 am

I understand there’s a visual impact, but what are the environmental concerns about transmission lines?

Oh god, I bet it's the whole EM sensitivity and radiation rubbish

They kill huge numbers of birds and bats, especially during migration periods (meaning that the impact is international). Can post some references this evening if folk are interested.

There is a similar issue with wind turbines, but those tend to be more localised whereas power cables in this instance would be stretching across an entire country. There is ongoing research into how to minimise impacts of cables but it's not there yet.

Obviously this has to be weighed against the negative impacts of climate change, coal mining etcetera, which is by no means straightforward. But please don't just dismiss environmentalists as a load of woolly-brained idiots before doing any research whatsoever (and I notice that bmforre didn't bother to link to anything the environmentalists have actually written).

nekomatic wrote: ↑

Wed Nov 13, 2019 11:26 am

You could make any currently-oil-derived feedstock you like from plant-based sources if the economics are right. It’s just a question of capital investment in the kit, that and growing enough of the plants.

Grumble wrote: ↑

Wed Nov 13, 2019 1:06 pm

I remember reading about cranes (or storks?) in South Africa flying into power lines. The reason given was that birds don’t necessarily look ahead, they look at the ground.

DrTf wrote: ↑

Wed Nov 13, 2019 1:07 pm

nekomatic wrote: ↑

Wed Nov 13, 2019 11:26 am

It’s just a question of capital investment in the kit, that and growing enough of the plants.

My bold. So where will you do that then? Looks innocent

nekomatic wrote: ↑

Wed Nov 13, 2019 2:46 pm

DrTf wrote: ↑

Wed Nov 13, 2019 1:07 pm

nekomatic wrote: ↑

Wed Nov 13, 2019 11:26 am

It’s just a question of capital investment in the kit, that and growing enough of the plants.

My bold. So where will you do that then? Looks innocent

Obviously my ‘just’ is doing some heavy lifting there. The idea of processing biomass from things like fast-growing trees (as currently used to substitute coal in power stations, for e.g.) in ‘biorefineries’ is fairly well advanced though.