US Election

Discussions about serious topics, for serious people
Post Reply
EACLucifer
Catbabel
Posts: 944
Joined: Fri Dec 13, 2019 7:49 am
Location: Behind you

Re: US Election

Post by EACLucifer » Thu Nov 19, 2020 1:34 pm

dyqik wrote:
Thu Nov 19, 2020 12:44 am
Is it bad if you put the judge's signature on an order you've just submitted before he rules on it?
Is it also bad if you don't realise you need to file a motion to amend the submission until prompted in court, and that your amended version is completely and utterly insane and bears no relation to the original submission written by competent lawyers who wisely withdrew from this lolsuit?

User avatar
jimbob
After Pie
Posts: 1810
Joined: Mon Nov 11, 2019 4:04 pm
Location: High Peak/Manchester

Re: US Election

Post by jimbob » Thu Nov 19, 2020 5:53 pm

EACLucifer wrote:
Thu Nov 19, 2020 1:34 pm
dyqik wrote:
Thu Nov 19, 2020 12:44 am
Is it bad if you put the judge's signature on an order you've just submitted before he rules on it?
Is it also bad if you don't realise you need to file a motion to amend the submission until prompted in court, and that your amended version is completely and utterly insane and bears no relation to the original submission written by competent lawyers who wisely withdrew from this lolsuit?
I am not a lawyer - so I'll just say, it is on-brand at least.
Have you considered stupidity as an explanation

User avatar
dyqik
Stummy Beige
Posts: 2753
Joined: Wed Sep 25, 2019 4:19 pm
Location: Masshole
Contact:

Re: US Election

Post by dyqik » Thu Nov 19, 2020 5:56 pm

Hmm, apparently George Soros conspired with Hugo Chavez to steal Trump's re-election from him.

Hugo Chavez died in 2013.

User avatar
Woodchopper
After Pie
Posts: 2077
Joined: Sat Oct 12, 2019 9:05 am

Re: US Election

Post by Woodchopper » Thu Nov 19, 2020 5:58 pm

Allo V Psycho wrote:
Thu Nov 19, 2020 11:54 am
Woodchopper wrote:
Wed Nov 18, 2020 8:50 pm
You can all laugh but according to this poll 70% of Republicans think that Biden’s win was due to fraud.
https://twitter.com/akarl_smith/status/ ... 73440?s=21

Seems to be the same as the last four years. Lots of people laughing at what is actually a successful strategy to influence millions of voters.

I’ll bet that for years to come, pretty much anyone wanting to get elected as a Republican will have to state that Trump was cheated out of victory by Biden, and that Biden is not a legitimate President. Trump will be out of the Whitehouse but Trumpism goes on.
This article summarises exactly what I've been fearing, along these lines. And I think is well written.

https://www.nybooks.com/articles/2020/1 ... afterlife/
It’s a good article. Depressing, but at the same time uplifting, as if someone can write that well there’s hope for humanity.

I feel like a lot of the criticism of Trump is akin to people watching the filming of Birth of a Nation and pointing out that the sets are made of cardboard and the guns aren’t real. The Trump and Republican project isn’t about reality, the point is to construct a myth.

User avatar
Little waster
Dorkwood
Posts: 1036
Joined: Tue Nov 12, 2019 12:35 am
Location: About 1 inch behind my eyes

Re: US Election

Post by Little waster » Thu Nov 19, 2020 6:05 pm

dyqik wrote:
Thu Nov 19, 2020 5:56 pm
Hmm, apparently George Soros conspired with Hugo Chavez to steal Trump's re-election from him.
Presumably Herman Cain retweeted this today.
People who use Godwin's Law are worse than Hitler.

monkey
Fuzzable
Posts: 245
Joined: Wed Nov 13, 2019 5:10 pm

Re: US Election

Post by monkey » Thu Nov 19, 2020 6:36 pm

dyqik wrote:
Thu Nov 19, 2020 5:56 pm
Hmm, apparently George Soros conspired with Hugo Chavez to steal Trump's re-election from him.

Hugo Chavez died in 2013.
The Clintons and Antifa were all up in there too.

It seems to me they're using the courts like a reality TV show. As long as they have Rudy et al. making their claims, the events can be edited by the Trump friendly "journalists" to give the narrative they want. While we're all laughing at the stupidity of it, they're building up a story that's going to end with the courts being corrupt. Trumpers watching ONAN will believe it, because it's the only story they'll see.

User avatar
Woodchopper
After Pie
Posts: 2077
Joined: Sat Oct 12, 2019 9:05 am

Re: US Election

Post by Woodchopper » Thu Nov 19, 2020 6:43 pm

monkey wrote:
Thu Nov 19, 2020 6:36 pm
dyqik wrote:
Thu Nov 19, 2020 5:56 pm
Hmm, apparently George Soros conspired with Hugo Chavez to steal Trump's re-election from him.

Hugo Chavez died in 2013.
The Clintons and Antifa were all up in there too.

It seems to me they're using the courts like a reality TV show. As long as they have Rudy et al. making their claims, the events can be edited by the Trump friendly "journalists" to give the narrative they want. While we're all laughing at the stupidity of it, they're building up a story that's going to end with the courts being corrupt. Trumpers watching ONAN will believe it, because it's the only story they'll see.
Yes, that's the game plan. Millions of angry disillusioned voters who'll keep supporting Trump someone like him. Its part of a long term strategy, and its being executed as we watch.

User avatar
lpm
After Pie
Posts: 2117
Joined: Mon Nov 11, 2019 1:05 pm
Location: COUNT THE VOTE. STOP THE COUNT.

Re: US Election

Post by lpm » Thu Nov 19, 2020 6:55 pm

Does anyone actually watch OANN?

The extremists who do are going to stay extremists. It matters more if regular Fox watching Trump supporters are gradually deflated by a bit of reality on Fox.
I'll miss him after he's fled to Riyadh

EACLucifer
Catbabel
Posts: 944
Joined: Fri Dec 13, 2019 7:49 am
Location: Behind you

Re: US Election

Post by EACLucifer » Thu Nov 19, 2020 7:04 pm

lpm wrote:
Thu Nov 19, 2020 6:55 pm
Does anyone actually watch OANN?

The extremists who do are going to stay extremists. It matters more if regular Fox watching Trump supporters are gradually deflated by a bit of reality on Fox.
It's worth remembering that a lot of the danger of Fox is that it is slickly produced and if you don't know otherwise, often presents things in a way that is quite believable to someone who just isn't politically engaged. OANN is dangerous in that it is willing to traffic in total, absolute b.llsh.t rather than just heavily slanting something that at least resembles reality, but it only really works on existing believers, while Fox can push bad ideas to the otherwise unengaged.

FlammableFlower
Catbabel
Posts: 792
Joined: Mon Nov 11, 2019 1:22 pm

Re: US Election

Post by FlammableFlower » Thu Nov 19, 2020 7:18 pm

Apparently OANN has reported audience figures of 14,000 max. However, apparently they don't conform to the minimum standards, or numbers, too have their data properly compiled - so it could be more...

monkey
Fuzzable
Posts: 245
Joined: Wed Nov 13, 2019 5:10 pm

Re: US Election

Post by monkey » Thu Nov 19, 2020 7:39 pm

lpm wrote:
Thu Nov 19, 2020 6:55 pm
Does anyone actually watch OANN?

The extremists who do are going to stay extremists. It matters more if regular Fox watching Trump supporters are gradually deflated by a bit of reality on Fox.
It's more than just ONAN. I just used them for shorthand. The Trumpshphere is larger than only them. Something bigger than ONAN that have convinced 70% of Republican voters that there was widespread election fraud, and it seems to me that the Trump campaign is taking their strategy from the way reality TV constructs a narrative, something that you'd imagine Trump knows about, being a reality TV star. I'm worried that it's working, and that it's going to get harder to fix the longer it goes on.

Another problem is that the extremists are also the loudest and currently at the top of the party. And that influences what regular GOP politicians do and say, if they want to keep their jobs. They've all seen what happens to e.g. Jeff Sessions if you don't toe the line, and those people get to go on Fox News and talk. The Trumpshere exerts an influence much larger than size.

User avatar
Bird on a Fire
Light of Blast
Posts: 4292
Joined: Fri Oct 11, 2019 5:05 pm
Location: nadir of brie

Re: US Election

Post by Bird on a Fire » Thu Nov 19, 2020 7:41 pm

OANN's logo is super similar to the Onion News Network's, and I don't back myself to distinguish their articles more successfully than chance.

Yet more evidence for the hypothesis that reality and satire are converging.
THINK BIG AND UPEND THE SYSTEM

#ShowYourStripes

User avatar
Little waster
Dorkwood
Posts: 1036
Joined: Tue Nov 12, 2019 12:35 am
Location: About 1 inch behind my eyes

Re: US Election

Post by Little waster » Thu Nov 19, 2020 7:51 pm

FlammableFlower wrote:
Thu Nov 19, 2020 7:18 pm
Apparently OANN has reported audience figures of 14,000 max. However, apparently they don't conform to the minimum standards, or numbers, too have their data properly compiled - so it could be more...
As a long time watcher of Trump rallies I can confirm that there are definitely more than 14000 ONANists in America.
People who use Godwin's Law are worse than Hitler.

User avatar
Bird on a Fire
Light of Blast
Posts: 4292
Joined: Fri Oct 11, 2019 5:05 pm
Location: nadir of brie

Re: US Election

Post by Bird on a Fire » Thu Nov 19, 2020 7:55 pm

EACLucifer wrote:
Wed Nov 18, 2020 6:11 pm
AND NOW the Giuliani lolsuit has had its evidenciary hearing, which was due tomorrow, cancelled by Judge Brann. I don't think this bodes well for the lolsuit, and Id be unsurprised if it were found they lack standing, especially given how badly Giuliani handled the standing part of it.
Giuliani does often seem to have trouble with standing.
THINK BIG AND UPEND THE SYSTEM

#ShowYourStripes

User avatar
Little waster
Dorkwood
Posts: 1036
Joined: Tue Nov 12, 2019 12:35 am
Location: About 1 inch behind my eyes

Re: US Election

Post by Little waster » Thu Nov 19, 2020 7:59 pm

In regards to Fox, that human--shaped clump of shower-drain pubes Sean Hannity declared Rudy's humiliating performance in front of the judge as "absolutely brilliant".

That's so far beyond Barking his best bet is to wait till Upminster and then Uber it back.
People who use Godwin's Law are worse than Hitler.

User avatar
dyqik
Stummy Beige
Posts: 2753
Joined: Wed Sep 25, 2019 4:19 pm
Location: Masshole
Contact:

Re: US Election

Post by dyqik » Thu Nov 19, 2020 8:29 pm

lpm wrote:
Thu Nov 19, 2020 6:55 pm
Does anyone actually watch OANN?

The extremists who do are going to stay extremists. It matters more if regular Fox watching Trump supporters are gradually deflated by a bit of reality on Fox.
The more distant bits of my Texas family do. The closer bits just listen to Limbaugh, which is relatively safer.

EACLucifer
Catbabel
Posts: 944
Joined: Fri Dec 13, 2019 7:49 am
Location: Behind you

Re: US Election

Post by EACLucifer » Thu Nov 19, 2020 8:41 pm

To be clear, laughing at these lawsuits is not seeking to downplay them. I've already made it clear that maximum pressure should be brought to end the charade. That said, one thing fascists really, really hate is being laughed at.

User avatar
Vertigowooyay
Fuzzable
Posts: 299
Joined: Mon Nov 11, 2019 1:25 pm

Re: US Election

Post by Vertigowooyay » Thu Nov 19, 2020 8:59 pm

Apparently Hugo Chavez and George Soros are part of the conspiracy. Which, on the part of Chavez, is impressive foresight for someone who died 7 years ago.
Calm yourself Doctor NotTheNineO’ClockNews. We’re men of science. We fear no worldly terrors.

monkey
Fuzzable
Posts: 245
Joined: Wed Nov 13, 2019 5:10 pm

Re: US Election

Post by monkey » Thu Nov 19, 2020 9:40 pm

EACLucifer wrote:
Thu Nov 19, 2020 8:41 pm
To be clear, laughing at these lawsuits is not seeking to downplay them. I've already made it clear that maximum pressure should be brought to end the charade. That said, one thing fascists really, really hate is being laughed at.
I've been laughing too, I think my comments were aimed at me, if anyone in particular. I just remembered being a bit too complacent about Trump in 2016.

EACLucifer
Catbabel
Posts: 944
Joined: Fri Dec 13, 2019 7:49 am
Location: Behind you

Re: US Election

Post by EACLucifer » Thu Nov 19, 2020 11:56 pm

bjn wrote:
Wed Nov 18, 2020 10:02 pm
My hope is that this somehow splits the utter right wing crazies off from the normal rightwing crazies and the right can fight itself for a while. Trump TV vs FoxNEWs would be interesting, or could just push Fox off into utter crazy.
Some republicans likely to face utter lunatics in their primaries. May struggle if utter lunatics follow behaviour current republicans are tacitly supporting with Trump and do not concede after primary defeat.

EACLucifer
Catbabel
Posts: 944
Joined: Fri Dec 13, 2019 7:49 am
Location: Behind you

Re: US Election

Post by EACLucifer » Thu Nov 19, 2020 11:58 pm

EACLucifer wrote:
Wed Nov 18, 2020 8:30 pm
Image

Another lolsuit incoming, this one in Georgia (or George, or Georiga, as Trumpists have been spelling it lately). For those not in the know, Lin Wood is not the most hinged of fellows.
And it is denied! It included this moment;

Judge Grimberg: “What’s the constitutional claim he’s (Wood) bringing on the recount?”
(Long pause)
Grimberg: “Procedural due process or substantive due process?”
Smith: “Both.”
Grimberg: “Both? Can you explain?”

Would I be right in thinking the question Judge Grimberg is asking here is roughly akin to "do you want to bat first or field first" in that one really does have to pick one?

EACLucifer
Catbabel
Posts: 944
Joined: Fri Dec 13, 2019 7:49 am
Location: Behind you

Re: US Election

Post by EACLucifer » Thu Nov 19, 2020 11:59 pm

Grumble wrote:
Wed Nov 18, 2020 7:00 pm
Lolsuit

9687AFE9-68FF-432D-9540-DCE5CFF70B8F.jpeg
They lost that one too. And a time wasting attempt to delay certification in Arizona. That's three losses in a few hours, and I think 32 in total, in exchange for one very small gain upholding an existing rule and affecting a tiny number of ballots.

User avatar
dyqik
Stummy Beige
Posts: 2753
Joined: Wed Sep 25, 2019 4:19 pm
Location: Masshole
Contact:

Re: US Election

Post by dyqik » Fri Nov 20, 2020 12:32 am

The Arizona one came with a very heavy hint that a motion for legal costs for the state would be granted.

User avatar
dyqik
Stummy Beige
Posts: 2753
Joined: Wed Sep 25, 2019 4:19 pm
Location: Masshole
Contact:

Re: US Election

Post by dyqik » Fri Nov 20, 2020 12:33 am

EACLucifer wrote:
Thu Nov 19, 2020 11:56 pm
bjn wrote:
Wed Nov 18, 2020 10:02 pm
My hope is that this somehow splits the utter right wing crazies off from the normal rightwing crazies and the right can fight itself for a while. Trump TV vs FoxNEWs would be interesting, or could just push Fox off into utter crazy.
Some republicans likely to face utter lunatics in their primaries. May struggle if utter lunatics follow behaviour current republicans are tacitly supporting with Trump and do not concede after primary defeat.
They could always try to support popular policies that the majority of the general electorate want...

EACLucifer
Catbabel
Posts: 944
Joined: Fri Dec 13, 2019 7:49 am
Location: Behind you

Re: US Election

Post by EACLucifer » Fri Nov 20, 2020 1:36 am

dyqik wrote:
Fri Nov 20, 2020 12:32 am
The Arizona one came with a very heavy hint that a motion for legal costs for the state would be granted.
Dismissed with prejudice, and court has ordered that the state can file for legal costs, yeah.

One of the most transparently meritless bits of delaying I've seen. They basically argued that because Maricopa County used a polling centre model rather than a precinct model, that the audit confirming the machine count by hand counting 2% of polling centres was wrong, because the law orginally referred to precincts. Either way, 2% of the vote would be audited, and I fail to see what kind of harm they claimed they might suffer, especially what kind of redressable individualised harm that standing rules depend upon, and I fail to see what they might gain by changing the size of the audit, or why this ought to delay certification in any way.

Post Reply