TV shows being cut or taken down for racism

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jimbob
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Re: TV shows being cut or taken down for racism

Post by jimbob » Mon Jul 06, 2020 10:46 am

discovolante wrote:
Mon Jul 06, 2020 9:03 am
Just seen this thread on Twitter about David Walliams' kids books. I didn't know and now I have to wonder how sorry he actually is:

https://twitter.com/BootstrapCook/statu ... 83432?s=20
Ha I just came to post that too.

Some of those examples wouldn't be out of place in a 1970s sitcom

https://twitter.com/BootstrapCook/statu ... 45344?s=20
Have you considered stupidity as an explanation

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Re: TV shows being cut or taken down for racism

Post by discovolante » Mon Jul 06, 2020 10:53 am

jimbob wrote:
Mon Jul 06, 2020 10:46 am
discovolante wrote:
Mon Jul 06, 2020 9:03 am
Just seen this thread on Twitter about David Walliams' kids books. I didn't know and now I have to wonder how sorry he actually is:

https://twitter.com/BootstrapCook/statu ... 83432?s=20
Ha I just came to post that too.

Some of those examples wouldn't be out of place in a 1970s sitcom

https://twitter.com/BootstrapCook/statu ... 45344?s=20
Yeah...digressing slightly but David Walliams has always seemed a bit iffy to me, some of the celebrity company he keeps seems a bit off. But anyway.
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Re: TV shows being cut or taken down for racism

Post by jimbob » Mon Jul 06, 2020 2:36 pm

discovolante wrote:
Mon Jul 06, 2020 10:53 am
jimbob wrote:
Mon Jul 06, 2020 10:46 am
discovolante wrote:
Mon Jul 06, 2020 9:03 am
Just seen this thread on Twitter about David Walliams' kids books. I didn't know and now I have to wonder how sorry he actually is:

https://twitter.com/BootstrapCook/statu ... 83432?s=20
Ha I just came to post that too.

Some of those examples wouldn't be out of place in a 1970s sitcom

https://twitter.com/BootstrapCook/statu ... 45344?s=20
Yeah...digressing slightly but David Walliams has always seemed a bit iffy to me, some of the celebrity company he keeps seems a bit off. But anyway.
I haven't looked at the company he keeps. I was uneasy about Little Britain - but never watched it, just the trailers seemed to often involve punching down.

I don't think my kids read any of his books - but that was nothing to do with me, except for my not pushing them, whilst I did push books I used to like.
Have you considered stupidity as an explanation

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Re: TV shows being cut or taken down for racism

Post by FlammableFlower » Mon Jul 06, 2020 3:34 pm

I can remember Little Britain and The League of Gentlemen from when they were on Radio 4. Didn't exactly like LB then and really didn't like it on the TV. Liked the LoG a lot on the radio, less so on TV...

Walliams is someone I've never found, from his media appearances, pleasant at all and his books, or at least the adaptations of them (that considering he's appeared in I presume he approves of), seem highly unpleasant in tone and lazy stereotypes used.

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Re: TV shows being cut or taken down for racism

Post by monkey » Mon Jul 06, 2020 4:09 pm

discovolante wrote:
Mon Jul 06, 2020 9:03 am
Just seen this thread on Twitter about David Walliams' kids books. I didn't know and now I have to wonder how sorry he actually is:

https://twitter.com/BootstrapCook/statu ... 83432?s=20
I did not know anything about his books either, and now I'm wondering about how sorry he is too. I said he seemed like a nice person and everything! Seems he's lazy, doesn't think and hasn't done anything to fix it.

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Re: TV shows being cut or taken down for racism

Post by discovolante » Mon Jul 06, 2020 5:27 pm

monkey wrote:
Mon Jul 06, 2020 4:09 pm
discovolante wrote:
Mon Jul 06, 2020 9:03 am
Just seen this thread on Twitter about David Walliams' kids books. I didn't know and now I have to wonder how sorry he actually is:

https://twitter.com/BootstrapCook/statu ... 83432?s=20
I did not know anything about his books either, and now I'm wondering about how sorry he is too. I said he seemed like a nice person and everything! Seems he's lazy, doesn't think and hasn't done anything to fix it.
This is all me drawing inferences from vague stuff and things from a while ago, but he's been pally with Philip Green and I've seen jokes on panel shows being made about his love of the celeb lifestyle. Which you know could just be a love of glitz and glamour but I dunno, there can be a lot of seediness to that as well. I could be wrong but he's just not someone I'd particularly want to spend time with. Anyway this is a bit of a digression, sorry.
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Re: TV shows being cut or taken down for racism

Post by Tessa K » Mon Jul 06, 2020 6:21 pm

There's a twin to the threads on Walliams on Twitter that's about Roald Dahl. People are quoting his bit from The Twits about how ugly thoughts make ugly people. This is apparently a criticism of Walliams.

1. This teaches kids that anyone who is not good looking is evil
2. All the 'examples' of ugly thoughts/ugly face I've seen posted are of older women. No matter how vile their opinions, this is sexist shite.

Some people are saying 'if you don't like his books don't read them' which not only overlooks the fact he's spreading various kinds of prejudice but also that kids are often given books to read by adults who have no idea what's in them or who think it's all 'harmless' fun.

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Re: TV shows being cut or taken down for racism

Post by Woodchopper » Mon Jul 06, 2020 8:07 pm

Tessa K wrote:
Mon Jul 06, 2020 6:21 pm
There's a twin to the threads on Walliams on Twitter that's about Roald Dahl. People are quoting his bit from The Twits about how ugly thoughts make ugly people. This is apparently a criticism of Walliams.

1. This teaches kids that anyone who is not good looking is evil
2. All the 'examples' of ugly thoughts/ugly face I've seen posted are of older women. No matter how vile their opinions, this is sexist shite.

Some people are saying 'if you don't like his books don't read them' which not only overlooks the fact he's spreading various kinds of prejudice but also that kids are often given books to read by adults who have no idea what's in them or who think it's all 'harmless' fun.
That one has a recent history
https://www.mirror.co.uk/news/politics/ ... g-11594695
https://twitter.com/Rachael_Swindon/sta ... 92065?s=20

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Re: TV shows being cut or taken down for racism

Post by Tessa K » Tue Jul 07, 2020 9:45 am

Woodchopper wrote:
Mon Jul 06, 2020 8:07 pm
Tessa K wrote:
Mon Jul 06, 2020 6:21 pm
There's a twin to the threads on Walliams on Twitter that's about Roald Dahl. People are quoting his bit from The Twits about how ugly thoughts make ugly people. This is apparently a criticism of Walliams.

1. This teaches kids that anyone who is not good looking is evil
2. All the 'examples' of ugly thoughts/ugly face I've seen posted are of older women. No matter how vile their opinions, this is sexist shite.

Some people are saying 'if you don't like his books don't read them' which not only overlooks the fact he's spreading various kinds of prejudice but also that kids are often given books to read by adults who have no idea what's in them or who think it's all 'harmless' fun.
That one has a recent history
https://www.mirror.co.uk/news/politics/ ... g-11594695
https://twitter.com/Rachael_Swindon/sta ... 92065?s=20
What about Resting Bitch Face?

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Re: TV shows being cut or taken down for racism

Post by bjn » Tue Jul 07, 2020 10:49 am

Tessa K wrote:
Mon Jul 06, 2020 6:21 pm
There's a twin to the threads on Walliams on Twitter that's about Roald Dahl. People are quoting his bit from The Twits about how ugly thoughts make ugly people. This is apparently a criticism of Walliams.

1. This teaches kids that anyone who is not good looking is evil
2. All the 'examples' of ugly thoughts/ugly face I've seen posted are of older women. No matter how vile their opinions, this is sexist shite.

Some people are saying 'if you don't like his books don't read them' which not only overlooks the fact he's spreading various kinds of prejudice but also that kids are often given books to read by adults who have no idea what's in them or who think it's all 'harmless' fun.
Re: 1, not it doesn't. To directly quote Dhal.
If a person has ugly thoughts, it begins to show on the face. And when that person has ugly thoughts every day, every week, every year, the face gets uglier and uglier until you can hardly bear to look at it.

A person who has good thoughts cannot ever be ugly. You can have a wonky nose and a crooked mouth and a double chin and stick-out teeth, but if you have good thoughts it will shine out of your face like sunbeams and you will always look lovely.
He's saying the exact opposite, he explicitly stating you can have “hideous“ features and not be 'ugly', inner nastiness will shine through however.
Last edited by bjn on Tue Jul 07, 2020 11:01 am, edited 1 time in total.

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Re: TV shows being cut or taken down for racism

Post by bjn » Tue Jul 07, 2020 11:00 am

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Re: TV shows being cut or taken down for racism

Post by Tessa K » Tue Jul 07, 2020 2:26 pm

bjn wrote:
Tue Jul 07, 2020 10:49 am
Tessa K wrote:
Mon Jul 06, 2020 6:21 pm
There's a twin to the threads on Walliams on Twitter that's about Roald Dahl. People are quoting his bit from The Twits about how ugly thoughts make ugly people. This is apparently a criticism of Walliams.

1. This teaches kids that anyone who is not good looking is evil
2. All the 'examples' of ugly thoughts/ugly face I've seen posted are of older women. No matter how vile their opinions, this is sexist shite.

Some people are saying 'if you don't like his books don't read them' which not only overlooks the fact he's spreading various kinds of prejudice but also that kids are often given books to read by adults who have no idea what's in them or who think it's all 'harmless' fun.
Re: 1, not it doesn't. To directly quote Dhal.
If a person has ugly thoughts, it begins to show on the face. And when that person has ugly thoughts every day, every week, every year, the face gets uglier and uglier until you can hardly bear to look at it.

A person who has good thoughts cannot ever be ugly. You can have a wonky nose and a crooked mouth and a double chin and stick-out teeth, but if you have good thoughts it will shine out of your face like sunbeams and you will always look lovely.
He's saying the exact opposite, he explicitly stating you can have “hideous“ features and not be 'ugly', inner nastiness will shine through however.
But the people quoting him are only quoting the first part. That's the problem.

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Re: TV shows being cut or taken down for racism

Post by bjn » Tue Jul 07, 2020 3:42 pm

Fools will always mistake things and use them wrongly. I remember reading that passage to my girls when they were small and it stuck with me and them. (I read it for the first time in my forties.)

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Re: TV shows being cut or taken down for racism

Post by Stephanie » Tue Jul 07, 2020 5:33 pm

Isn't the problem that there are plenty of good looking bad folk? Inner nastiness doesn't always shine through.
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Re: TV shows being cut or taken down for racism

Post by Bird on a Fire » Tue Jul 07, 2020 9:35 pm

Stephanie wrote:
Tue Jul 07, 2020 5:33 pm
Isn't the problem that there are plenty of good looking bad folk? Inner nastiness doesn't always shine through.
Yeah, I think it's a nice idea that ugly thoughts would show on the face, but in reality it doesn't seem to be the case - people get away with being absolute monsters for ages. So it probably isn't the best message to be giving kids, even though it does seem to be a well intentioned idea from a more innocent time.
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Re: TV shows being cut or taken down for racism

Post by Tessa K » Wed Jul 08, 2020 8:26 am

Bird on a Fire wrote:
Tue Jul 07, 2020 9:35 pm
Stephanie wrote:
Tue Jul 07, 2020 5:33 pm
Isn't the problem that there are plenty of good looking bad folk? Inner nastiness doesn't always shine through.
Yeah, I think it's a nice idea that ugly thoughts would show on the face, but in reality it doesn't seem to be the case - people get away with being absolute monsters for ages. So it probably isn't the best message to be giving kids, even though it does seem to be a well intentioned idea from a more innocent time.
Absolutely not the case as we see from people who committed terrible acts over long periods without being caught. Then when they are caught people say 'Oh but he was always so polite and friendly' or 'He was always good to his mother' or 'She looked so normal'. If the bad people had horns and a tail and went round snarling it would be so much easier.

And of course on TV and in films the villains are often good looking. You can't judge a book by its cover...

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Re: TV shows being cut or taken down for racism

Post by Martin Y » Thu Jul 23, 2020 12:32 pm

<stands> I have never seen Spaced. <pause for effect, sits>

I watched a few eps last night, and winced a little as Mark Heap glowingly described his former performance art collaborator (David Walliams in blueface) and Simon Pegg ventured "Wot, a tranny?" to which Heap demurred and Pegg added "Ah. A fat tranny". It was a different time.

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Re: TV shows being cut or taken down for racism

Post by shpalman » Thu Jul 23, 2020 12:41 pm

Martin Y wrote:
Thu Jul 23, 2020 12:32 pm
<stands> I have never seen Spaced. <pause for effect, sits>

I watched a few eps last night, and winced a little as Mark Heap glowingly described his former performance art collaborator (David Walliams in blueface) and Simon Pegg ventured "Wot, a tranny?" to which Heap demurred and Pegg added "Ah. A fat tranny". It was a different time.
"I can imagine"

<cut scene of ridiculous performance art>

"No, we did valuable work"

<exactly the same cut scene>

Just about everything else in there has held up well though I think.

In the DVD commentary of Big Train (which involves some of the same people, and was made before Spaced, but the commentary for the DVD was recorded a long while later) they realize watching it back that it just didn't occur to them to give roles to the female actors in general sketches.
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Re: TV shows being cut or taken down for racism

Post by Martin Y » Thu Jul 23, 2020 12:49 pm

shpalman wrote:
Thu Jul 23, 2020 12:41 pm
Just about everything else in there has held up well though I think.
It is, I feel, on balance, f.cking ace.

We were jugging babies at that time and there's just a chasm in my must-watch TV cultural experience.

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Re: TV shows being cut or taken down for racism

Post by shpalman » Thu Jul 23, 2020 1:00 pm

Martin Y wrote:
Thu Jul 23, 2020 12:49 pm
shpalman wrote:
Thu Jul 23, 2020 12:41 pm
Just about everything else in there has held up well though I think.
It is, I feel, on balance, f.cking ace.

We were jugging babies at that time and there's just a chasm in my must-watch TV cultural experience.
My favourite of the Three Flavours Cornetto trilogy is The World's End which seems to be much less heard of than the other two.
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Re: TV shows being cut or taken down for racism

Post by Martin Y » Thu Jul 23, 2020 2:00 pm

I watched The Worlds End with the same baby who prevented me watching Spaced all those years before.

The gag where teetotaller Nick Frost gets pissed, says "f.ck it" and clumsily smashes the pub door window on the way out had her shrieking with laughter. She's very rewarding to watch films with.

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Re: TV shows being cut or taken down for racism

Post by shpalman » Thu Jul 23, 2020 2:16 pm

Martin Y wrote:
Thu Jul 23, 2020 2:00 pm
I watched The Worlds End with the same baby who prevented me watching Spaced all those years before.

The gag where teetotaller Nick Frost gets pissed, says "f.ck it" and clumsily smashes the pub door window on the way out had her shrieking with laughter. She's very rewarding to watch films with.
I enjoyed the scene in which Simon Pegg's character is trying not to spill his pint while fighting.
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