The slow puncture to our economy has certainly begun, as has increased parochialism and a brain drain. Imports and exports have been hit and we’re still in the transition period. Many important protections are on the hit list. NI is turning into a sh.t show. There are queues at the airports. There is still no plan. The UK’s moderating voice against EU centralisation has been lost and the rapacious bastards in power in the UK now have a free hand due to the populist approach taken by Leave. Empty shelves and inflation were also areas of concern. Hadn’t predicted lorry drivers being told to take speed but there you go.
Brexit Consequences
Re: Brexit Consequences
Re: Brexit Consequences
Honda’s in Swindon, which was at the time the UKs 4th largest car factory, shut in July this year. They cited Brexit as one of the main reasons. So yeah, it’s directly leading to car factory closures and unemployment.
One back at the ever dissembling Sheldrake, what have we gained that has made up for the chaos? Ineffable “freedom from Brussels” will be considered pure dissembling.
One back at the ever dissembling Sheldrake, what have we gained that has made up for the chaos? Ineffable “freedom from Brussels” will be considered pure dissembling.
Re: Brexit Consequences
I see no sign of a brain drain in London technology companies, and net migration to the UK is higher than it was in 2016.
https://migrationobservatory.ox.ac.uk/r ... om-the-uk/
Our economy is growing faster than Germany's and the EU average: https://tradingeconomics.com/country-li ... rowth-rate
as recently as 2019 our exports were higher than they were in 2016 https://wits.worldbank.org/CountryProfi ... 19/Summary (I haven't found 2020 data yet)
I don't see evidence for what you're saying about exports and a brain drain are true, but I don't know how to measure 'parochialism' so that could be true.
Empty shelves not a thing where I live, and inflation is definitely about printing money to hand out during lockdown rather than leaving the EU.Empty shelves and inflation were also areas of concern. Hadn’t predicted lorry drivers being told to take speed but there you go.
Haven't been to an airport in a while, but I suspect it's got more to do with checking vaccine cards and covid test results at the moment.
Re: Brexit Consequences
Our vaccine program was faster than other EU countries'. Our economy is growing faster than the EU average and Germany's. I don't agree with Plodder that all of the regulations which will be abandoned or rewritten are 'important protections', and we have much more democratic accountability over what is done now.
I think your retort about 'freedom from Brussels' just highlights the gulf that exists between us in values. I think being able to vote policy makers out of office has value in and of itself, I genuinely don't analyse all these things through a lens of short term economic utility. If I did that then I'd be recommending we remodel the economy on Singapore or some other super-efficient Asian technocracy with very low taxes.
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- Catbabel
- Posts: 654
- Joined: Mon Nov 11, 2019 12:59 pm
- Location: Shropshire - Welsh Borders
Re: Brexit Consequences
Quoting percentage figures for thing like this can be totally misleading.sheldrake wrote: ↑Fri Sep 17, 2021 8:50 am
Our economy is growing faster than Germany's and the EU average: https://tradingeconomics.com/country-li ... rowth-rate
If, as an extreme example, the UK economy had grown fron 50% of what it was in, say, 2010, to 52% over a year, that'd be shown as a 4% year-on-year growth. If some other, Germany perhaps, had grown in the last year from 120% to 122% of its 2010 size, that would be a less than 2% growth. I think anyone sensible (eg not politicians) wouldn't claim the UK economy was the healthier.
WOULD CUSTOMERS PLEASE REFRAIN FROM SITTING ON THE COUNTER BY THE BACON SLICER - AS WE'RE GETTING A LITTLE BEHIND IN OUR ORDERS.
Re: Brexit Consequences
I think if we're making claims about Brexit, then looking at figures since 2016 would make the most sense. I also think that if our economy is growing faster than the EU average and Germany right now, it suggests that 'sick man of Europe as a result of something that recently happened' claims do not make sense.Lew Dolby wrote: ↑Fri Sep 17, 2021 10:10 amQuoting percentage figures for thing like this can be totally misleading.sheldrake wrote: ↑Fri Sep 17, 2021 8:50 am
Our economy is growing faster than Germany's and the EU average: https://tradingeconomics.com/country-li ... rowth-rate
If, as an extreme example, the UK economy had grown fron 50% of what it was in, say, 2010, to 52% over a year, that'd be shown as a 4% year-on-year growth. If some other, Germany perhaps, had grown in the last year from 120% to 122% of its 2010 size, that would be a less than 2% growth. I think anyone sensible (eg not politicians) wouldn't claim the UK economy was the healthier.
Re: Brexit Consequences
That was literally nothing to do with Brexit & anyone who thinks it was is a f.cking moron.
Oh, look who I'm replying to.
The MHRA approved the Pfizer vaccine (within an indecently short 24 hours, which fed a lot of vaccine hesitancy in the UK) using EU rules while the UK was still part of the EU regulatory system. The head of the MHRA, June Raine, stated as much at the time, clearly and unequivocally. This isn't a matter of opinion or debate, it's a fact.
The documents approving it were published online and an actually honest or inquisitive person is able to view them and see for themselves.
Hungary approved SinoVac & Sputnik using the same rules.
The vaccine purchasing scheme was entirely voluntary & Hungary among others have bought some vaccines outwith it, as well as within it.
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- Catbabel
- Posts: 654
- Joined: Mon Nov 11, 2019 12:59 pm
- Location: Shropshire - Welsh Borders
Re: Brexit Consequences
The year is irrelevant. I'm simply saying that relative stats can be misleading.sheldrake wrote: ↑Fri Sep 17, 2021 10:54 amI think if we're making claims about Brexit, then looking at figures since 2016 would make the most sense. I also think that if our economy is growing faster than the EU average and Germany right now, it suggests that 'sick man of Europe as a result of something that recently happened' claims do not make sense.Lew Dolby wrote: ↑Fri Sep 17, 2021 10:10 amQuoting percentage figures for thing like this can be totally misleading.sheldrake wrote: ↑Fri Sep 17, 2021 8:50 am
Our economy is growing faster than Germany's and the EU average: https://tradingeconomics.com/country-li ... rowth-rate
If, as an extreme example, the UK economy had grown fron 50% of what it was in, say, 2010, to 52% over a year, that'd be shown as a 4% year-on-year growth. If some other, Germany perhaps, had grown in the last year from 120% to 122% of its 2010 size, that would be a less than 2% growth. I think anyone sensible (eg not politicians) wouldn't claim the UK economy was the healthier.
WOULD CUSTOMERS PLEASE REFRAIN FROM SITTING ON THE COUNTER BY THE BACON SLICER - AS WE'RE GETTING A LITTLE BEHIND IN OUR ORDERS.
Re: Brexit Consequences
In some circumstances, but I don't think the data supports the view that Britain's economy has been crippled or made uncompetitive by leaving the EU.
Re: Brexit Consequences
The UK also had a harder COVID dip, so there was more to grow back from. So meh.Lew Dolby wrote: ↑Fri Sep 17, 2021 10:10 amQuoting percentage figures for thing like this can be totally misleading.sheldrake wrote: ↑Fri Sep 17, 2021 8:50 am
Our economy is growing faster than Germany's and the EU average: https://tradingeconomics.com/country-li ... rowth-rate
If, as an extreme example, the UK economy had grown fron 50% of what it was in, say, 2010, to 52% over a year, that'd be shown as a 4% year-on-year growth. If some other, Germany perhaps, had grown in the last year from 120% to 122% of its 2010 size, that would be a less than 2% growth. I think anyone sensible (eg not politicians) wouldn't claim the UK economy was the healthier.
Re: Brexit Consequences
It also grew back faster because we were able to do a faster vaccine rollout. UK exports and skilled immigration continued to grow after the 2016 vote.
The disaster theories being promulgated by the Cameron govt, Bank of England officials and some broadsheet newspapers have largely been proven untrue.
The disaster theories being promulgated by the Cameron govt, Bank of England officials and some broadsheet newspapers have largely been proven untrue.
- Woodchopper
- Princess POW
- Posts: 7082
- Joined: Sat Oct 12, 2019 9:05 am
Re: Brexit Consequences
There was a massive drop in migration to the UK in 2020. However, that was obviously affected by Covid, so it'll be difficult to know the effect of the end of the transition period.sheldrake wrote: ↑Fri Sep 17, 2021 8:50 amI see no sign of a brain drain in London technology companies, and net migration to the UK is higher than it was in 2016.
https://migrationobservatory.ox.ac.uk/r ... om-the-uk/
https://www.gov.uk/government/statistic ... ember-2020
Re: Brexit Consequences
The migration data end in 2019, and show a large reduction in immigration to the UK for purposes of work in the 4 years up to 2019, if you go to the bottom of the page. We have no data post end 2019, and of course moving people around has been unusually difficult since end 2019 because pandemic.sheldrake wrote: ↑Fri Sep 17, 2021 8:50 amI see no sign of a brain drain in London technology companies, and net migration to the UK is higher than it was in 2016.
https://migrationobservatory.ox.ac.uk/r ... om-the-uk/
Our economy is growing faster than Germany's and the EU average: https://tradingeconomics.com/country-li ... rowth-rate
as recently as 2019 our exports were higher than they were in 2016 https://wits.worldbank.org/CountryProfi ... 19/Summary (I haven't found 2020 data yet)
I don't see evidence for what you're saying about exports and a brain drain are true, but I don't know how to measure 'parochialism' so that could be true.
The GDP figures are meaningless, because they are all about recovery from whatever happened in the pandemic dip just now. We had a larger dip than Germany, so will naturally have a larger recovery, even if the net effect over the pandemic is a larger reduction. Let's compare the actual GDP per capita amount, not annual growth rates, which can be so misleading.
2019 exports were inflated because people were trying hard to move stuff before the Brexit Moment, in correct anticipation of immediate difficulties in moving stuff after the Moment.
So I don't see this data suffices to support your point.
Re: Brexit Consequences
I think you missed this bit in big lettersIvanV wrote: ↑Fri Sep 17, 2021 1:37 pm
The migration data end in 2019, and show a large reduction in immigration to the UK for purposes of work in the 4 years up to 2019, if you go to the bottom of the page. We have no data post end 2019, and of course moving people around has been unusually difficult since end 2019 because pandemic.
"Study and work are the most common reasons for immigration to the UK, but their contribution to net migration cannot currently be accurately calculated"
I work for an international company constantly recruiting in London, so I also see our own hiring pipeline. We're not having problems here.
But the speed we recover at is meaningful.The GDP figures are meaningless, because they are all about recovery from whatever happened in the pandemic dip just now.
But GDP per capita is dependent on years of prior growth before any Brexit effect could possibly have happened. I think this is an unreasonable and inaccurate way of assessing the impact of Brexit.We had a larger dip than Germany, so will naturally have a larger recovery, even if the net effect over the pandemic is a larger reduction. Let's compare the actual GDP per capita amount, not annual growth rates, which can be so misleading.
This is an unsupported hypothesis. Honestly, I think you're clutching at straws to avoid facing the reality; all that scary stuff the Independent told you about Brexit was mostly not true.2019 exports were inflated because people were trying hard to move stuff before the Brexit Moment, in correct anticipation of immediate difficulties in moving stuff after the Moment.
Re: Brexit Consequences
I shan't argue with you again. I've learned there is no point.
Re: Brexit Consequences
Not if you're going to keep bringing a potato peeler to a gunfight, no.
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- After Pie
- Posts: 1621
- Joined: Mon Mar 16, 2020 4:02 am
Re: Brexit Consequences
We still have the House of Lords which needs to be dissolved or shaken up seriously, but most of our executive is made up of commons MPs. EU Commissioners are all appointees, selected by the head of the commission who only stands for a secret vote, and that person usually runs unopposed. It's impossible to get rid of individual commissioners, the EU parliament has to vote by a 2/3rds majority to get rid of the whole commission. There's just no real individual accountability. Bojo can just lose an election by a couple of constituencies and be gone. He's much more scared of pissing to many of you off than any EU commissioner would ever be.
- Trinucleus
- Dorkwood
- Posts: 992
- Joined: Mon Nov 11, 2019 6:45 pm
Re: Brexit Consequences
We're in Greece and I can't watch Sky Go on my tablet
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- After Pie
- Posts: 1621
- Joined: Mon Mar 16, 2020 4:02 am
Re: Brexit Consequences
That is quite obviously false. Considering what he has been doing since gaining power he clearly holds us in complete contempt and knows that he is completely beyond accountability.
Re: Brexit Consequences
I think this is hyperbole. He’s done a lot of what the electorate wanted him to do, its just that a lot of the electorate dont agree with you. You’ll be getting a vote again soon, its just that having a vote doesnt guarantee your opinions prevail.Millennie Al wrote: ↑Sun Sep 19, 2021 1:52 amThat is quite obviously false. Considering what he has been doing since gaining power he clearly holds us in complete contempt and knows that he is completely beyond accountability.
Re: Brexit Consequences
Of course you can - get a VPN on there
ETA: you'd have to watch it through the tablet browser rather than the app IIRC.
Non fui. Fui. Non sum. Non curo.
Re: Brexit Consequences
- Cardinal Fang
- Snowbonk
- Posts: 421
- Joined: Tue Nov 12, 2019 7:42 pm
Re: Brexit Consequences
NordVPN is very good. Not been anywhere where I can't access UK sites if I want to
(Likewise in the UK never been able to not access US versions of Netflix, Disney Plus etc)
CF
(Likewise in the UK never been able to not access US versions of Netflix, Disney Plus etc)
CF