Council-backed entertainment park to house "Chariots of the Gods" Theme Park

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Council-backed entertainment park to house "Chariots of the Gods" Theme Park

Post by Fishnut » Tue Jan 26, 2021 1:05 pm

According to the Manchester Evening News Blackpool Council is about to start using compulsory purchase orders to secure land for a £300m "entertainment complex". The main tenant of this complex is going to be an indoor theme and adventure park called "Chariots of the Gods Entertainment Park" whose exhibits are going to be based on the debunked ideas of Erich von Däniken.

It seems this park has been several years in the planning - the compulsory purchase orders are just the latest step. The council seem very excited by the park. For example, on their council website they say,
The proposed themed of the site is ‘Chariots of the Gods’ (COTG) - a series of novels written by Eric Von Däniken in the 1960s and 1970s, based upon unsolved mysteries of the past, such as the pyramids of Egypt and Mexico, ancient cave drawings, the monuments of Easter Island and alien visitors!

The project is a collaboration between Nikal Ltd, and Media Invest Entertainment, which owns the intellectual property rights of Chariots Of The Gods.

Blackpool Council is working closely with both parties to help ‘unlock’ this development opportunity which is envisaged to be delivered over several phases over an 8-9 year period.
As I'm sure I don't need to remind people, the books are based on the racist assumption that "primitive" civilisations couldn't have built complex structures and so it must have been aliens wot did it. Given we are living in an era where conspiracy theories and "alternative facts" abound, the support the council is showing to this park seems decidedly unwise.

I understand the need for councils to regenerate sites, but this seems like a terrible way to go about it. It's not even as if von Däniken-inspired theme parks are successful. The only other one I can find, in Switzerland, closed after 3 years due to poor attendance.
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Re: Council-backed entertainment park to house "Chariots of the Gods" Theme Park

Post by Tessa K » Tue Jan 26, 2021 1:45 pm

Fishnut wrote:
Tue Jan 26, 2021 1:05 pm
According to the Manchester Evening News Blackpool Council is about to start using compulsory purchase orders to secure land for a £300m "entertainment complex". The main tenant of this complex is going to be an indoor theme and adventure park called "Chariots of the Gods Entertainment Park" whose exhibits are going to be based on the debunked ideas of Erich von Däniken.

It seems this park has been several years in the planning - the compulsory purchase orders are just the latest step. The council seem very excited by the park. For example, on their council website they say,
The proposed themed of the site is ‘Chariots of the Gods’ (COTG) - a series of novels written by Eric Von Däniken in the 1960s and 1970s, based upon unsolved mysteries of the past, such as the pyramids of Egypt and Mexico, ancient cave drawings, the monuments of Easter Island and alien visitors!

The project is a collaboration between Nikal Ltd, and Media Invest Entertainment, which owns the intellectual property rights of Chariots Of The Gods.

Blackpool Council is working closely with both parties to help ‘unlock’ this development opportunity which is envisaged to be delivered over several phases over an 8-9 year period.
As I'm sure I don't need to remind people, the books are based on the racist assumption that "primitive" civilisations couldn't have built complex structures and so it must have been aliens wot did it. Given we are living in an era where conspiracy theories and "alternative facts" abound, the support the council is showing to this park seems decidedly unwise.

I understand the need for councils to regenerate sites, but this seems like a terrible way to go about it. It's not even as if von Däniken-inspired theme parks are successful. The only other one I can find, in Switzerland, closed after 3 years due to poor attendance.
When it opens it could be a good day trip for any local skeptics. Maybe a banner that reads You do know this is all made up sh.t, right?

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Re: Council-backed entertainment park to house "Chariots of the Gods" Theme Park

Post by plodder » Tue Jan 26, 2021 2:08 pm

Obvious corrupt council is obviously corrupt.

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Re: Council-backed entertainment park to house "Chariots of the Gods" Theme Park

Post by Martin Y » Tue Jan 26, 2021 2:21 pm

"... a series of novels".

Novels?

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Re: Council-backed entertainment park to house "Chariots of the Gods" Theme Park

Post by Bird on a Fire » Tue Jan 26, 2021 3:20 pm

Martin Y wrote:
Tue Jan 26, 2021 2:21 pm
"... a series of novels".

Novels?
Yes, I clocked that. They've changed it to 'books' now.

Purely on the charge of racism, it's worth bearing in mind that von Däniken uses examples from every continent, including stuff like Stone Henge, the Old Testament, cartography from the Age of Discovery, etc etc. For all the flaws in his arguments, I'm not sure it quite makes much sense to accuse him of being racist against every race simultaneously. He just thinks it's more likely the aliens came to Earth lots of times and in lots of places millennia apart, than that people figured out how to build things.
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Re: Council-backed entertainment park to house "Chariots of the Gods" Theme Park

Post by Bird on a Fire » Tue Jan 26, 2021 3:25 pm

From MEN:
Phase one of the development is expected to feature an indoor adventure sports centre, the flying theatre, arcades, laser tag, bumper cars, a virtual reality experience, an exhibition exploring theories that aliens influenced ancient civilisations and an alien-themed diner, as well as a hotel and an events square.

Residential property, food and drinks outlets, another hotel and car parking is expected to follow.
This sounds incredibly kitsch, and good fun. It'll fit right in in Blackpool. Hopefully they keep the pseudoscience at arms length and just have fun with the silly 1960s ideas - you know, like those films with that furry-bikini lady fighting a dinosaur and stuff. If the exhibit is going to treat von Däniken's ideas as credible, there's a problem, but it could also just be lightweight infotainment. "Was it these indentured workers whose living quarters have been documented in great detail? [Photos 1,2,3] Or wAs iT aLiEnS?"

It seems like quite a smart way to monetise the intellectual property of thoroughly debunked books. Erich is still alive, so they've got at least 70 more years of royalties to come in via the gift shop.
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Re: Council-backed entertainment park to house "Chariots of the Gods" Theme Park

Post by Martin Y » Tue Jan 26, 2021 3:28 pm

Of course it was racism: he falsely appropriated all that ancient stuff claiming aliens built it when clearly it was the fairies.

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Re: Council-backed entertainment park to house "Chariots of the Gods" Theme Park

Post by Bird on a Fire » Tue Jan 26, 2021 3:30 pm

Nah, it's classism. The 99% built all that sh.t with their blood, sweat and tears and we only remember the names of kings, gods and aliens.
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Re: Council-backed entertainment park to house "Chariots of the Gods" Theme Park

Post by jaap » Tue Jan 26, 2021 3:39 pm

Bird on a Fire wrote:
Tue Jan 26, 2021 3:25 pm
This sounds incredibly kitsch, and good fun. It'll fit right in in Blackpool. Hopefully they keep the pseudoscience at arms length and just have fun with the silly 1960s ideas - you know, like those films with that furry-bikini lady fighting a dinosaur and stuff. If the exhibit is going to treat von Däniken's ideas as credible, there's a problem, but it could also just be lightweight infotainment.
I'd associate it more with Stargate, but unfortunately they won't have the rights to that. A proper Stargate themepark could be awesome.

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Re: Council-backed entertainment park to house "Chariots of the Gods" Theme Park

Post by Martin Y » Tue Jan 26, 2021 3:47 pm

This is not Harry Potter. The thing about these books is that you were supposed to take them seriously. So it will be interesting to see if they treat the subject ironically. I suspect if the rights owners want to extract value rather than preach the gospel of alien visitations it'll be wall-to-wall "I'm not saying it was aliens - But it was aliens" tee shirts.

A Nazca-Lines-alien-spaceport themed bumper car ride might be huge fun, but if they're going to try to insist it's not just pretend, that would just be weird.

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Re: Council-backed entertainment park to house "Chariots of the Gods" Theme Park

Post by Gfamily » Tue Jan 26, 2021 3:54 pm

Bird on a Fire wrote:
Tue Jan 26, 2021 3:20 pm
Martin Y wrote:
Tue Jan 26, 2021 2:21 pm
"... a series of novels".

Novels?
Yes, I clocked that. They've changed it to 'books' now.

Purely on the charge of racism, it's worth bearing in mind that von Däniken uses examples from every continent, including stuff like Stone Henge, the Old Testament, cartography from the Age of Discovery, etc etc. For all the flaws in his arguments, I'm not sure it quite makes much sense to accuse him of being racist against every race simultaneously. He just thinks it's more likely the aliens came to Earth lots of times and in lots of places millennia apart, than that people figured out how to build things.
No, I think it is racist - the 'must have been aliens' is based on an assumption that earlier cultures were simply incapable of the organisation and artisanship needed to make stonehenge, pyramids, Nazca lines etc. etc.

This, in turn comes from an assumption of the cultural superiority of the west which it uniquely gained as a result of the specific elements of its Judaeo Christian heritage based on the Greek and Roman underpinnings.

It's the same assumption that made people think that the Benin Bronzes must have been the result of Portuguese metal working and artistic influences reaching West Africa.
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Re: Council-backed entertainment park to house "Chariots of the Gods" Theme Park

Post by Martin Y » Tue Jan 26, 2021 4:03 pm

Is it still Western racism if he thought the aliens built Stonehenge?

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Re: Council-backed entertainment park to house "Chariots of the Gods" Theme Park

Post by Bird on a Fire » Tue Jan 26, 2021 4:07 pm

Gfamily wrote:
Tue Jan 26, 2021 3:54 pm
Bird on a Fire wrote:
Tue Jan 26, 2021 3:20 pm
Martin Y wrote:
Tue Jan 26, 2021 2:21 pm
"... a series of novels".

Novels?
Yes, I clocked that. They've changed it to 'books' now.

Purely on the charge of racism, it's worth bearing in mind that von Däniken uses examples from every continent, including stuff like Stone Henge, the Old Testament, cartography from the Age of Discovery, etc etc. For all the flaws in his arguments, I'm not sure it quite makes much sense to accuse him of being racist against every race simultaneously. He just thinks it's more likely the aliens came to Earth lots of times and in lots of places millennia apart, than that people figured out how to build things.
No, I think it is racist - the 'must have been aliens' is based on an assumption that earlier cultures were simply incapable of the organisation and artisanship needed to make stonehenge, pyramids, Nazca lines etc. etc.

This, in turn comes from an assumption of the cultural superiority of the west which it uniquely gained as a result of the specific elements of its Judaeo Christian heritage based on the Greek and Roman underpinnings.

It's the same assumption that made people think that the Benin Bronzes must have been the result of Portuguese metal working and artistic influences reaching West Africa.
Is prejudice against 'earlier cultures' racism?

It's ages since I read it (as a teenager, for shiggles - and I wasn't impressed), but I didn't get the impression then of the cultural superiority of the west and Judaeo-Christian, because western and Judaeo-Christian cultures are also considered incapable of having done things. It's about the cultural superiority of aliens over humans of all races and creeds AFAICT.

The assumptions about Benin Bronzes etc. is clearly pitting one race against other. Chariots of the Gods? pits aliens against humans of all races. While there's clearly some overlap, I don't think it's quite the same thing.

I can't even imagine that the book would be particularly useful to (e.g.) white supremacists, because while it says that African's couldn't have built the pyramids on their own it also says that God and the angels and various Old Testament figures are all aliens.
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Re: Council-backed entertainment park to house "Chariots of the Gods" Theme Park

Post by Gfamily » Tue Jan 26, 2021 4:12 pm

Martin Y wrote:
Tue Jan 26, 2021 4:03 pm
Is it still Western racism if he thought the aliens built Stonehenge?
Yes - because the assumed greatness the West has now didn't exist then, so how on earth could earlier cultures have achieved anything of comparable greatness.
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Re: Council-backed entertainment park to house "Chariots of the Gods" Theme Park

Post by Martin Y » Tue Jan 26, 2021 4:28 pm

Gfamily wrote:
Tue Jan 26, 2021 4:12 pm
Martin Y wrote:
Tue Jan 26, 2021 4:03 pm
Is it still Western racism if he thought the aliens built Stonehenge?
Yes - because the assumed greatness the West has now didn't exist then, so how on earth could earlier cultures have achieved anything of comparable greatness.
So the West presumably achieved its rise to greatness through help from aliens too. Probably one of those 2001 obelisk things. It's aliens all the way down.

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Re: Council-backed entertainment park to house "Chariots of the Gods" Theme Park

Post by Gfamily » Tue Jan 26, 2021 4:41 pm

Martin Y wrote:
Tue Jan 26, 2021 4:28 pm
Gfamily wrote:
Tue Jan 26, 2021 4:12 pm
Martin Y wrote:
Tue Jan 26, 2021 4:03 pm
Is it still Western racism if he thought the aliens built Stonehenge?
Yes - because the assumed greatness the West has now didn't exist then, so how on earth could earlier cultures have achieved anything of comparable greatness.
So the West presumably achieved its rise to greatness through help from aliens too. Probably one of those 2001 obelisk things. It's aliens all the way down.
No, no, no; we were gifted our greatness from the unique historical path taken by our ancestors. Otherwise the people the aliens helped would have done as well as us.
Obviously.
Of course, it's a real burden being the top culture, but fortunately we were up to it when the time came for us to step up.
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Re: Council-backed entertainment park to house "Chariots of the Gods" Theme Park

Post by Martin Y » Tue Jan 26, 2021 5:12 pm

Okay, but sort-of-seriously just for a moment, is that idea in any of E Von D's books or are we just poking fun at exceptionalism because it's amusing? Was he in fact an equal opportunities belittler of ancient cultures?

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Re: Council-backed entertainment park to house "Chariots of the Gods" Theme Park

Post by Gfamily » Tue Jan 26, 2021 5:45 pm

Martin Y wrote:
Tue Jan 26, 2021 5:12 pm
Okay, but sort-of-seriously just for a moment, is that idea in any of E Von D's books or are we just poking fun at exceptionalism because it's amusing? Was he in fact an equal opportunities belittler of ancient cultures?
I think it's real that there was an assumption that "ancient culture X couldn't have done Y", therefore it must have been aliens.
And (I would say) that is exactly the same mindset that makes racist assumptions about other people and cultures
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Re: Council-backed entertainment park to house "Chariots of the Gods" Theme Park

Post by Bird on a Fire » Tue Jan 26, 2021 5:50 pm

Martin Y wrote:
Tue Jan 26, 2021 5:12 pm
Okay, but sort-of-seriously just for a moment, is that idea in any of E Von D's books or are we just poking fun at exceptionalism because it's amusing? Was he in fact an equal opportunities belittler of ancient cultures?
As I recall he also posits the role of aliens in the development of Western societies. The Bible is definitely in there, for instance.

He wasn't talking about particular periods of history, either. One of the weaknesses in his argument is that it requires aliens to visit Egypt, and only Egypt, at one time, and Mesopotamia at another, and Peru at another, and so on. Right through to the Age of Discovery with stuff like the Piri Reis map, which at least implies that Columbus navigated to the New World with the help of aliens. Which suggests that European colonialism resulted from alien intervention, rather than inherent supremacy.

I certainly don't recall any explicit Western exceptionalism, but it was ~15 years ago now. Have you read it, Gfamily?
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Re: Council-backed entertainment park to house "Chariots of the Gods" Theme Park

Post by Gfamily » Tue Jan 26, 2021 5:59 pm

Bird on a Fire wrote:
Tue Jan 26, 2021 5:50 pm
Martin Y wrote:
Tue Jan 26, 2021 5:12 pm
Okay, but sort-of-seriously just for a moment, is that idea in any of E Von D's books or are we just poking fun at exceptionalism because it's amusing? Was he in fact an equal opportunities belittler of ancient cultures?
As I recall he also posits the role of aliens in the development of Western societies. The Bible is definitely in there, for instance.

He wasn't talking about particular periods of history, either. One of the weaknesses in his argument is that it requires aliens to visit Egypt, and only Egypt, at one time, and Mesopotamia at another, and Peru at another, and so on. Right through to the Age of Discovery with stuff like the Piri Reis map, which at least implies that Columbus navigated to the New World with the help of aliens. Which suggests that European colonialism resulted from alien intervention, rather than inherent supremacy.

I certainly don't recall any explicit Western exceptionalism, but it was ~15 years ago now. Have you read it, Gfamily?
I would have read it 40+ years ago, and I'm not saying there was any explicit racism, and no specific Western exceptionalism.
But the presumption that 'they couldn't have done that' is exactly the same dismissive attitude that expresses as cultural racism today.
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Re: Council-backed entertainment park to house "Chariots of the Gods" Theme Park

Post by Bird on a Fire » Tue Jan 26, 2021 6:06 pm

Yes, it's certainly an attitude shared by a lot of racists. But I think the way it appears in Chariots of the Gods isn't racist, and I don't think the book would be much use to a racist agenda either given that it extends the same attitude to the west (IIRC).
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Re: Council-backed entertainment park to house "Chariots of the Gods" Theme Park

Post by Cardinal Fang » Tue Jan 26, 2021 6:57 pm

Skeptics in the Pub Online last week had Mirko Gutjahr talking about Pseudo-archeology, including the likes of the "aliens built the pyramids" claim. It's now available on the SiTP-O YouTube channel if peeps are interested: https://www.youtube.com/sitponline

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Re: Council-backed entertainment park to house "Chariots of the Gods" Theme Park

Post by Tessa K » Wed Jan 27, 2021 9:31 am

A quick search brought this up, which brings him down on the racist side. When I posted about this on Twitter there was the inevitable old white guy saying it's not racism it's just bad research. Hhm.

http://www.jasoncolavito.com/blog/the-a ... on-daniken

They will probably skirt round the racist elements in the theme park but no doubt sell the books in the gift shop. I'd like to know what an 'alien themed diner' would be like. Does it involve any probing?

Also, how many people have even heard of him? It's not something younger people would automatically be attracted to, like Marvel or Potter.

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Re: Council-backed entertainment park to house "Chariots of the Gods" Theme Park

Post by Martin Y » Wed Jan 27, 2021 10:01 am

That's true, 50 years ago he had the ancient aliens game all to himself, but people who might go to a theme park today weren't born then. Sure there are lots of crappy ancient aliens "documentaries" on TV which might name-check him but again young people aren't watching TV so they probably only get seen by older people looking for landfill war documentaries or reruns of Foyle's War. I guess that leaves do-your-own-research conspiracy nuttery on YouTube but they're unlikely to bother to name-check him as the only name they need to squeeze into every upload is their miracle-working saint Tesla.

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Re: Council-backed entertainment park to house "Chariots of the Gods" Theme Park

Post by lpm » Wed Jan 27, 2021 10:30 am

Lol, the people who go to a Blackpool "theme park" won't be buying books in the gift shop. They won't even bother to stock books in the gift shop.

This will be a Winter Wonderland type of "theme park". A couple of crappy rides worse than those of a touring carnival, a burger bar with hilarious puns, a really bad VR show - and endless arcade games, fruit machines and those things where you drop 2p coins in and hope loads more 2p coins fall out the bottom.

The only link to Von Daniken will be a peeling sticker of an alien covering up the damp patch on the burger bar wall.
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