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Re: Old buildings need inspection and control
Posted: Wed Jun 30, 2021 6:55 pm
by Martin Y
Not sure how many condos there were in total but 55 collapsed so maybe 75-80 in the whole structure. So $15M would be around $200k per apartment. Probably close to knock-it-down-and-rebuild prices.
Re: Old buildings need inspection and control
Posted: Wed Jun 30, 2021 8:27 pm
by bolo
Martin Y wrote: ↑Wed Jun 30, 2021 6:55 pm
Not sure how many condos there were in total but 55 collapsed so maybe 75-80 in the whole structure. So $15M would be around $200k per apartment. Probably close to knock-it-down-and-rebuild prices.
Looks like a 2 bedroom unit would set you back $700k+, pre-collapse, and some of the larger (maybe penthouse?) units have sold for close to $3 million.
https://www.zillow.com/b/champlain-towe ... fl-5ZJTRr/
I have no idea how much of that will be retained in the land value now that the "knock it down" decision has been made for them.
Re: Old buildings need inspection and control
Posted: Wed Jun 30, 2021 10:04 pm
by bolo
Majority of Florida condo board quit in 2019 as squabbling residents dragged out plans for repairs
Oops.
The president of the board of the Florida condominium that collapsed last week resigned in 2019, partly in frustration over what she saw as the sluggish response to an engineer’s report that identified major structural damage the previous year.
Anette Goldstein was among five members of the seven-member board to resign in two weeks that fall, according to minutes from an Oct. 3 meeting, at a time when the condo association in Surfside was consumed by contentious debate about the multimillion-dollar repairs.
“We work for months to go in one direction and at the very last minute objections are raised that should have been discussed and resolved right in the beginning,” Goldstein wrote in a September 2019 resignation letter. “This pattern has repeated itself over and over, ego battles, undermining the roles of fellow board members, circulation of gossip and mistruths. I am not presenting a very pretty picture of the functioning of our board and many before us, but it describes a board that works very hard but cannot for the reasons above accomplish the goals we set out to accomplish.”
Re: Old buildings need inspection and control
Posted: Wed Jun 30, 2021 11:21 pm
by Martin Y
bolo wrote: ↑Wed Jun 30, 2021 8:27 pm
Looks like a 2 bedroom unit would set you back $700k+, pre-collapse, and some of the larger (maybe penthouse?) units have sold for close to $3 million.
https://www.zillow.com/b/champlain-towe ... fl-5ZJTRr/
I have no idea how much of that will be retained in the land value now that the "knock it down" decision has been made for them.
I'm sure the prices were high but a great deal of that would be due to the location. I suspect only a small proportion of it would be the cost of the structure.
Re: Old buildings need inspection and control
Posted: Thu Jul 01, 2021 1:38 am
by Martin_B
bolo wrote: ↑Wed Jun 30, 2021 8:27 pm
Martin Y wrote: ↑Wed Jun 30, 2021 6:55 pm
Not sure how many condos there were in total but 55 collapsed so maybe 75-80 in the whole structure. So $15M would be around $200k per apartment. Probably close to knock-it-down-and-rebuild prices.
Looks like a 2 bedroom unit would set you back $700k+, pre-collapse, and some of the larger (maybe penthouse?) units have sold for close to $3 million.
https://www.zillow.com/b/champlain-towe ... fl-5ZJTRr/
I have no idea how much of that will be retained in the land value now that the "knock it down" decision has been made for them.
Is that the tower that collapsed? It doesn't look like a 40 year old building in those pictures. Maybe rennervations were spent on the wrong things.
Re: Old buildings need inspection and control
Posted: Thu Jul 01, 2021 2:07 am
by bolo
The listing details for the unit I just clicked on says built 1981.
The owners would no doubt be more willing to spend money on making their individual homes look nice than on some boring structural thing in the garage.
Re: Old buildings need inspection and control
Posted: Thu Jul 01, 2021 10:16 am
by dyqik
bolo wrote: ↑Wed Jun 30, 2021 8:27 pm
Martin Y wrote: ↑Wed Jun 30, 2021 6:55 pm
Not sure how many condos there were in total but 55 collapsed so maybe 75-80 in the whole structure. So $15M would be around $200k per apartment. Probably close to knock-it-down-and-rebuild prices.
Looks like a 2 bedroom unit would set you back $700k+, pre-collapse, and some of the larger (maybe penthouse?) units have sold for close to $3 million.
https://www.zillow.com/b/champlain-towe ... fl-5ZJTRr/
I have no idea how much of that will be retained in the land value now that the "knock it down" decision has been made for them.
You have to really pity the bugger who bought a unit on the 16th June. Although I guess there's a chance that they hadn't moved in.
And the mortgage lender who signed off on that loan (assuming that there was one).
Re: Old buildings need inspection and control
Posted: Thu Jul 01, 2021 12:38 pm
by Bird on a Fire
Surely mortgage lenders and insurers are sufficiently aware of the risks involved with seafront properties these days, and take extra precautions?
Re: Old buildings need inspection and control
Posted: Thu Jul 01, 2021 4:03 pm
by dyqik
Bird on a Fire wrote: ↑Thu Jul 01, 2021 12:38 pm
Surely mortgage lenders and insurers are sufficiently aware of the risks involved with seafront properties these days, and take extra precautions?
This is the US real estate sector, and Florida in particular. You might have seen "The Big Short"...
There's loads of lenders, and varying size and propriety. Sensible ones will reinsure stuff, but there's potential trouble with that if there's a known problem with the property.
Re: Old buildings need inspection and control
Posted: Thu Jul 01, 2021 4:15 pm
by Martin Y
dyqik wrote: ↑Thu Jul 01, 2021 4:03 pm
You might have seen "The Big Short"...
That thought certainly crossed my mind. If you reward sales people for selling mortgages and don't reward them for turning down dodgy applications don't be surprised when they do the thing that pays.
I now wonder if the fallout from this disaster might be very much broader than this one property.
Re: Old buildings need inspection and control
Posted: Thu Jul 01, 2021 8:48 pm
by Bird on a Fire
Global capital seems oddly slow to cotton onto the upcoming environmental challenges. Kind of makes you wonder about the Homo economicus paradigm.
But I've already started a few hundred threads along those lines
It's a horrible tragedy, and I don't mean to detract from that at all. But I think we're going to be seeing a lot more of these kinds of events in the next few years.