Conspiracy Theories - A reading list

Discussions about serious topics, for serious people
User avatar
Fishnut
After Pie
Posts: 2447
Joined: Mon Nov 11, 2019 1:15 pm
Location: UK

Conspiracy Theories - A reading list

Post by Fishnut » Tue Jul 27, 2021 2:21 pm

I just came across this thread of recommendations for "books by academics & journalists which explain, historicise & contextualise where conspiracy theories come from, who believes them & why." There's some really excellent suggestions on there.
it's okay to say "I don't know"

User avatar
warumich
Fuzzable
Posts: 282
Joined: Mon Nov 11, 2019 10:49 pm

Re: Conspiracy Theories - A reading list

Post by warumich » Tue Jul 27, 2021 3:40 pm

Barkun, Michael. A culture of conspiracy. University of California Press, 2013.

Harambam, Jaron. Contemporary conspiracy culture: Truth and knowledge in an era of epistemic instability. Routledge, 2020.

Robertson, David G. UFOs, conspiracy theories and the new age: Millennial conspiracism. Bloomsbury Publishing, 2016.

Cassam, Quassim. Conspiracy theories. John Wiley & Sons, 2019.

(edited to clarify - these are a mixture of my personal favourites that are already on that rather good list (Barkun), plus two I liked that are probably too new or too British/European for that list. Plus Cassam, who was I thought my least favourite here, but seems to have sold pretty well.)
I've never had a signature, and it never did me any harm

User avatar
Little waster
After Pie
Posts: 2385
Joined: Tue Nov 12, 2019 12:35 am
Location: About 1 inch behind my eyes

Re: Conspiracy Theories - A reading list

Post by Little waster » Tue Jul 27, 2021 5:05 pm

On a related note the YouTube algorithm has decided that my recommended video list should currently mostly consist of Flat Earth videos and Debunking Flat Earth videos.

That’s one hell of a rabbit hole to go down. The sheer scope of the conspiracy required to keep a lid on the truth on Flat Earth beggars belief, primarily because virtually every aspect of science and everyday living has to have been deliberately and continually subverted to allow a Flat Earth to exist and even something as straightforward as the Seasons even existing and being different in different parts of the not-Globe requires a PhD thesis and a 3 hour video while I can teach a bright 7 year old how sol-centric seasons work in 5 minutes with no more than a torch and a globe. Essentially for the conspiracy to work about 80% of the population would need to be in on it.

On the meta level though neither side ever feels the need to explain what the supposed cui bono of the other side is, unlike say AGW-denial with competing narratives of watermelon crypto-communists taking on rightwing dogmatists and fossil fuel shills. I can only assume this is because they already feel this has been done to death already.

Reading between the lines I can only assume the Flat Earthers are coming from a very odd fringe of Biblical literalists with a highly specific and eccentric reading of their translation of the Bible working on the premise that all of the Globers are cooperating in a satanic plot to undermine the Biblical worldview. The irony of course being the Round Earth theory had been proven centuries before Christ ever whittled a tent-peg and no major Christian denomination has proposed a Flat Earth in a millennium or more.

It would be interesting to see if there are any other motivations for Flat Earthers, beyond sheer bl..dy contrarianism or mind-numbing stupidity.
This place is not a place of honor, no highly esteemed deed is commemorated here, nothing valued is here.
What is here was dangerous and repulsive to us.
This place is best shunned and left uninhabited.

monkey
After Pie
Posts: 1906
Joined: Wed Nov 13, 2019 5:10 pm

Re: Conspiracy Theories - A reading list

Post by monkey » Tue Jul 27, 2021 5:21 pm

I know there's always been flat earthers, but a few years ago I thought that the flat earth theory was coming back as an internet joke rather than a serious "theory"*, but now people seem to genuinely believe it.

Are there any examples of conspiracy theories starting out as jokes/hoaxes but then taking on a life of their own?


*ETA, by which I mean something that people take seriously, despite being as wrong as wrong can be.

User avatar
Little waster
After Pie
Posts: 2385
Joined: Tue Nov 12, 2019 12:35 am
Location: About 1 inch behind my eyes

Re: Conspiracy Theories - A reading list

Post by Little waster » Tue Jul 27, 2021 5:54 pm

monkey wrote:
Tue Jul 27, 2021 5:21 pm

Are there any examples of conspiracy theories starting out as jokes/hoaxes but then taking on a life of their own?
Slender Man went a bit too real very quickly.

Then there was this.

IIRC “carrots are good for night vision” is still on the go despite starting off as British disinformation in WW2 to help keep radar secret *awaits QI klaxon*
This place is not a place of honor, no highly esteemed deed is commemorated here, nothing valued is here.
What is here was dangerous and repulsive to us.
This place is best shunned and left uninhabited.

User avatar
Woodchopper
Princess POW
Posts: 7057
Joined: Sat Oct 12, 2019 9:05 am

Re: Conspiracy Theories - A reading list

Post by Woodchopper » Tue Jul 27, 2021 5:55 pm

monkey wrote:
Tue Jul 27, 2021 5:21 pm

Are there any examples of conspiracy theories starting out as jokes/hoaxes but then taking on a life of their own?
The Report From Iron Mountain

https://www.nytimes.com/1996/07/01/busi ... -item.html

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Repor ... n_Mountain

User avatar
Trinucleus
Catbabel
Posts: 985
Joined: Mon Nov 11, 2019 6:45 pm

Re: Conspiracy Theories - A reading list

Post by Trinucleus » Tue Jul 27, 2021 6:48 pm

Little waster wrote:
Tue Jul 27, 2021 5:05 pm
On a related note the YouTube algorithm has decided that my recommended video list should currently mostly consist of Flat Earth videos and Debunking Flat Earth videos.

That’s one hell of a rabbit hole to go down. The sheer scope of the conspiracy required to keep a lid on the truth on Flat Earth beggars belief, primarily because virtually every aspect of science and everyday living has to have been deliberately and continually subverted to allow a Flat Earth to exist and even something as straightforward as the Seasons even existing and being different in different parts of the not-Globe requires a PhD thesis and a 3 hour video while I can teach a bright 7 year old how sol-centric seasons work in 5 minutes with no more than a torch and a globe. Essentially for the conspiracy to work about 80% of the population would need to be in on it.

On the meta level though neither side ever feels the need to explain what the supposed cui bono of the other side is, unlike say AGW-denial with competing narratives of watermelon crypto-communists taking on rightwing dogmatists and fossil fuel shills. I can only assume this is because they already feel this has been done to death already.

Reading between the lines I can only assume the Flat Earthers are coming from a very odd fringe of Biblical literalists with a highly specific and eccentric reading of their translation of the Bible working on the premise that all of the Globers are cooperating in a satanic plot to undermine the Biblical worldview. The irony of course being the Round Earth theory had been proven centuries before Christ ever whittled a tent-peg and no major Christian denomination has proposed a Flat Earth in a millennium or more.

It would be interesting to see if there are any other motivations for Flat Earthers, beyond sheer bl..dy contrarianism or mind-numbing stupidity.
Apparently the young earth creationists, who say that the bible is clear that the earth is 6000 years old, are condemned by flat earthers for their wishy washy interpretation of the scriptures. The bible they say takes about the heavens above and the earth below

User avatar
Trinucleus
Catbabel
Posts: 985
Joined: Mon Nov 11, 2019 6:45 pm

Re: Conspiracy Theories - A reading list

Post by Trinucleus » Tue Jul 27, 2021 6:49 pm

Trinucleus wrote:
Tue Jul 27, 2021 6:48 pm
Little waster wrote:
Tue Jul 27, 2021 5:05 pm
On a related note the YouTube algorithm has decided that my recommended video list should currently mostly consist of Flat Earth videos and Debunking Flat Earth videos.

That’s one hell of a rabbit hole to go down. The sheer scope of the conspiracy required to keep a lid on the truth on Flat Earth beggars belief, primarily because virtually every aspect of science and everyday living has to have been deliberately and continually subverted to allow a Flat Earth to exist and even something as straightforward as the Seasons even existing and being different in different parts of the not-Globe requires a PhD thesis and a 3 hour video while I can teach a bright 7 year old how sol-centric seasons work in 5 minutes with no more than a torch and a globe. Essentially for the conspiracy to work about 80% of the population would need to be in on it.

On the meta level though neither side ever feels the need to explain what the supposed cui bono of the other side is, unlike say AGW-denial with competing narratives of watermelon crypto-communists taking on rightwing dogmatists and fossil fuel shills. I can only assume this is because they already feel this has been done to death already.

Reading between the lines I can only assume the Flat Earthers are coming from a very odd fringe of Biblical literalists with a highly specific and eccentric reading of their translation of the Bible working on the premise that all of the Globers are cooperating in a satanic plot to undermine the Biblical worldview. The irony of course being the Round Earth theory had been proven centuries before Christ ever whittled a tent-peg and no major Christian denomination has proposed a Flat Earth in a millennium or more.

It would be interesting to see if there are any other motivations for Flat Earthers, beyond sheer bl..dy contrarianism or mind-numbing stupidity.
Apparently the young earth creationists, who say that the bible is clear that the earth is 6000 years old, are condemned by flat earthers for their wishy washy interpretation of the scriptures. The bible they say talks about the heavens above and the earth below

monkey
After Pie
Posts: 1906
Joined: Wed Nov 13, 2019 5:10 pm

Re: Conspiracy Theories - A reading list

Post by monkey » Tue Jul 27, 2021 7:18 pm

Little waster wrote:
Tue Jul 27, 2021 5:54 pm
monkey wrote:
Tue Jul 27, 2021 5:21 pm

Are there any examples of conspiracy theories starting out as jokes/hoaxes but then taking on a life of their own?
Slender Man went a bit too real very quickly.

Then there was this.

IIRC “carrots are good for night vision” is still on the go despite starting off as British disinformation in WW2 to help keep radar secret *awaits QI klaxon*
On the slender man: I heard about that after the murders, but that's a ghost story gone wrong rather than a conspiracy theory. I suppose there are parallels with CT and folklore stuff though. The badgers doesn't seem to have the making it up for a laugh/satire/prove a point thing that I was thinking about, but it could well do, who knows? Carrots one: That's not really a conspiracy theory, just a common belief.
That's what I was wondering about. I've even seen That Sort of Thing in the wild, never heard of the book though.

Thinking about it more, I bet there's quite a few books that have led to people believing bonkers stuff - Dan Brown probably influenced a good few, and I bet the Illumuatus Trilogy led to more than the KLF (I've never read either, so not my fault).

User avatar
jdc
Hilda Ogden
Posts: 1925
Joined: Wed Sep 25, 2019 4:31 pm
Location: Your Mum

Re: Conspiracy Theories - A reading list

Post by jdc » Tue Jul 27, 2021 9:01 pm

Kerry Thornley and Greg Hill create Operation Mindfuck to parody conspiracy theories. They tell the world that the Illuminati are behind the chaos spreading through America in the 1960s.

The godfather of modern conspiracy theories, Jim Garrison, comes to believe that Thornley isn’t who he says he is; that really he helped kill President Kennedy, and was using Operation Mindfuck to hide that truth. In the end, Thornley even begins to doubt himself...
https://www.bbc.co.uk/programmes/profil ... y-thornley

Chris Preston
Snowbonk
Posts: 529
Joined: Tue Nov 12, 2019 8:05 am

Re: Conspiracy Theories - A reading list

Post by Chris Preston » Tue Jul 27, 2021 10:44 pm

Little waster wrote:
Tue Jul 27, 2021 5:05 pm
On a related note the YouTube algorithm has decided that my recommended video list should currently mostly consist of Flat Earth videos and Debunking Flat Earth videos.

That’s one hell of a rabbit hole to go down. The sheer scope of the conspiracy required to keep a lid on the truth on Flat Earth beggars belief, primarily because virtually every aspect of science and everyday living has to have been deliberately and continually subverted to allow a Flat Earth to exist and even something as straightforward as the Seasons even existing and being different in different parts of the not-Globe requires a PhD thesis and a 3 hour video while I can teach a bright 7 year old how sol-centric seasons work in 5 minutes with no more than a torch and a globe. Essentially for the conspiracy to work about 80% of the population would need to be in on it.
Even better is the version where Australia does not exist. The British invented it so they could send ships full of criminals off the edge of the world to get rid of them. If you have ever been to Australia, you really haven't. You have instead been taken to a secret location in South America full of actors wearing thongs, hats with corks and speaking in strange accents.

Apparently, there are people living in Australia, sorry South America, who believe this is true.
Here grows much rhubarb.

monkey
After Pie
Posts: 1906
Joined: Wed Nov 13, 2019 5:10 pm

Re: Conspiracy Theories - A reading list

Post by monkey » Tue Jul 27, 2021 10:52 pm

jdc wrote:
Tue Jul 27, 2021 9:01 pm
Kerry Thornley and Greg Hill create Operation Mindfuck to parody conspiracy theories. They tell the world that the Illuminati are behind the chaos spreading through America in the 1960s.

The godfather of modern conspiracy theories, Jim Garrison, comes to believe that Thornley isn’t who he says he is; that really he helped kill President Kennedy, and was using Operation Mindfuck to hide that truth. In the end, Thornley even begins to doubt himself...
https://www.bbc.co.uk/programmes/profil ... y-thornley
That's quite a deep rabbit hole he found.

I'm afraid to say I watched that and didn't remember that bit. I mostly remember being a bit confused about what the point was for a lot of it and the story about Mao's Wife. I listened to the soundtrack for a bit after too.

When I go to the wiki for Operation Mindfuck, it redirects to the The Illuminatus! Trilogy, what I mentioned earlier. I guess it did influence more than the KLF.

User avatar
Martin_B
After Pie
Posts: 1614
Joined: Mon Nov 11, 2019 1:20 pm
Location: Perth, WA

Re: Conspiracy Theories - A reading list

Post by Martin_B » Wed Jul 28, 2021 12:18 am

monkey wrote:
Tue Jul 27, 2021 7:18 pm
Little waster wrote:
Tue Jul 27, 2021 5:54 pm

IIRC “carrots are good for night vision” is still on the go despite starting off as British disinformation in WW2 to help keep radar secret *awaits QI klaxon*
Carrots one: That's not really a conspiracy theory, just a common belief.
I think QI claimed it was a sort of double bluff. The British government put out the idea that carrots were good for night vision, knowing that the Germans would hear about it and possibly believe that radar didn't exist. But Britain also knew that the Germans were working on radar and making rudimentary radar small enough to fit in planes (from equipment found in downed German planes). So while the radar thing was a bit of a story with some chance of distracting the Germans, the main aim was to get the British public eating carrots, which were easy and cheap to grow and helped feed an island population.
"My interest is in the future, because I'm going to spend the rest of my life there"

User avatar
Woodchopper
Princess POW
Posts: 7057
Joined: Sat Oct 12, 2019 9:05 am

Re: Conspiracy Theories - A reading list

Post by Woodchopper » Wed Jul 28, 2021 9:15 am

Martin_B wrote:
Wed Jul 28, 2021 12:18 am
monkey wrote:
Tue Jul 27, 2021 7:18 pm
Little waster wrote:
Tue Jul 27, 2021 5:54 pm

IIRC “carrots are good for night vision” is still on the go despite starting off as British disinformation in WW2 to help keep radar secret *awaits QI klaxon*
Carrots one: That's not really a conspiracy theory, just a common belief.
I think QI claimed it was a sort of double bluff. The British government put out the idea that carrots were good for night vision, knowing that the Germans would hear about it and possibly believe that radar didn't exist. But Britain also knew that the Germans were working on radar and making rudimentary radar small enough to fit in planes (from equipment found in downed German planes). So while the radar thing was a bit of a story with some chance of distracting the Germans, the main aim was to get the British public eating carrots, which were easy and cheap to grow and helped feed an island population.
Article here states that it was intended to encourage British people to eat more carrots. https://www.livescience.com/carrots-see ... -dark.html

That makes sense as German science was pretty good and I doubt that they would have been taken in.

User avatar
jimbob
Light of Blast
Posts: 5276
Joined: Mon Nov 11, 2019 4:04 pm
Location: High Peak/Manchester

Re: Conspiracy Theories - A reading list

Post by jimbob » Thu Jul 29, 2021 2:21 pm

If you want to see a conspiracy theorist facebook group before it goes private:

https://www.facebook.com/groups/2250137 ... ?ref=share

Lots of Nazis in there including a seemingly real post about the nice people at Combat 18

And completely stupid prepper ideas.
Have you considered stupidity as an explanation

cvb
Clardic Fug
Posts: 228
Joined: Tue Nov 12, 2019 8:15 am

Re: Conspiracy Theories - A reading list

Post by cvb » Tue Aug 03, 2021 9:49 am

Little waster wrote:
Tue Jul 27, 2021 5:05 pm
On a related note the YouTube algorithm has decided that my recommended video list should currently mostly consist of Flat Earth videos and Debunking Flat Earth videos.

That’s one hell of a rabbit hole to go down. The sheer scope of the conspiracy required to keep a lid on the truth on Flat Earth beggars belief, primarily because virtually every aspect of science and everyday living has to have been deliberately and continually subverted to allow a Flat Earth to exist and even something as straightforward as the Seasons even existing and being different in different parts of the not-Globe requires a PhD thesis and a 3 hour video while I can teach a bright 7 year old how sol-centric seasons work in 5 minutes with no more than a torch and a globe. Essentially for the conspiracy to work about 80% of the population would need to be in on it.

On the meta level though neither side ever feels the need to explain what the supposed cui bono of the other side is, unlike say AGW-denial with competing narratives of watermelon crypto-communists taking on rightwing dogmatists and fossil fuel shills. I can only assume this is because they already feel this has been done to death already.

Reading between the lines I can only assume the Flat Earthers are coming from a very odd fringe of Biblical literalists with a highly specific and eccentric reading of their translation of the Bible working on the premise that all of the Globers are cooperating in a satanic plot to undermine the Biblical worldview. The irony of course being the Round Earth theory had been proven centuries before Christ ever whittled a tent-peg and no major Christian denomination has proposed a Flat Earth in a millennium or more.

It would be interesting to see if there are any other motivations for Flat Earthers, beyond sheer bl..dy contrarianism or mind-numbing stupidity.
There is a lot of money being made through merch and subscriptions and a few people are making f.ck tons.

User avatar
dyqik
Princess POW
Posts: 7526
Joined: Wed Sep 25, 2019 4:19 pm
Location: Masshole
Contact:

Re: Conspiracy Theories - A reading list

Post by dyqik » Tue Aug 03, 2021 11:24 am

And there'll be tens to hundreds times more who think they are making money, and will be making tons of money from merch any day now, but who are really working well below minimum wage.

cvb
Clardic Fug
Posts: 228
Joined: Tue Nov 12, 2019 8:15 am

Re: Conspiracy Theories - A reading list

Post by cvb » Tue Aug 03, 2021 12:35 pm

dyqik wrote:
Tue Aug 03, 2021 11:24 am
And there'll be tens to hundreds times more who think they are making money, and will be making tons of money from merch any day now, but who are really working well below minimum wage.
Some time ago I watched thedocumentary Behind the Curve imdb Page
and a lot of those people are in it for the money and I don't think some of them even believe it themselves. The red headed lady in particular reall shone out as just bilking stupid people.

User avatar
TAFKAsoveda
Clardic Fug
Posts: 173
Joined: Mon Nov 11, 2019 7:15 pm

Re: Conspiracy Theories - A reading list

Post by TAFKAsoveda » Tue Aug 03, 2021 12:47 pm

cvb wrote:
Tue Aug 03, 2021 12:35 pm
dyqik wrote:
Tue Aug 03, 2021 11:24 am
And there'll be tens to hundreds times more who think they are making money, and will be making tons of money from merch any day now, but who are really working well below minimum wage.
Some time ago I watched thedocumentary Behind the Curve imdb Page
and a lot of those people are in it for the money and I don't think some of them even believe it themselves. The red headed lady in particular reall shone out as just bilking stupid people.
IIRC at one point she was condemned by other flat earth ears because her name is PatriCIA and therefore she is a plant working for the CIA and the Illuminati or some such. Why yes I have watched a lot of Conspiracy Catz and Scimandan videos why do you ask?

User avatar
bjn
Stummy Beige
Posts: 2915
Joined: Wed Sep 25, 2019 4:58 pm
Location: London

Re: Conspiracy Theories - A reading list

Post by bjn » Tue Aug 03, 2021 9:41 pm

The grand parent of them all is surely the Protocols of The Elders of Zion. Deliberately fabricated anti Jewish conspiracy created by the Tsarist police. Many millions taken in over a century since it was was drafted. More propaganda than hoax though.

User avatar
jdc
Hilda Ogden
Posts: 1925
Joined: Wed Sep 25, 2019 4:31 pm
Location: Your Mum

Re: Conspiracy Theories - A reading list

Post by jdc » Wed Aug 04, 2021 8:05 pm

The US seems a good place to find conspiracy theories, it looks like the anarchist pranksters were reviving an older USian conspiracy theory from way back when:
In the late 1790s, Jedidiah Morse, the congregational minister in Charlestown, Mass., and a well-known author of geography textbooks, drew national attention by suggesting that a secret organization called the Bavarian Illuminati was at work “to root out and abolish Christianity, and overturn all civil government.”
https://time.com/5892376/early-american ... cy-theory/

And conspiracy theorists becoming victims of conspiracy theories:
In the run-up to the 1832 election, the national organization of Freemasonry drew conspiracy theorists’ attention. Spurred on by the murder of a New York Mason named William Morgan, who had threatened to disclose the fraternal order’s secrets, an Anti-Masonic political party had emerged during the 1828 election. [...] During the 1832 campaign, they accused Freemasons of a number of transgressions beyond Morgan’s murder, including subversion of free speech and democracy. [...] But in that same election of 1832, Anti-Masons themselves became the target of conspiracy theorists. New York Democrats saw a plot afoot in the coalition of the Anti-Masonic Party and the National Republicans in their state.
https://www.smithsonianmag.com/history/ ... 180971940/

And something that has a shortlist of some of the US's favourite CTs over time:
Although many Americans believe that conspiratorial thinking is reaching new heights in the twenty-first century, conspiracy theories have been commonplace throughout U.S. history. In the colonial and early republic eras, Americans feared that Catholics, Jews, Masons, Indians, and African Americans were plotting against them. In the nineteenth century they added international bankers, rich businessmen, and Mormons to the list of potential conspirators. In the twentieth century, conspiracy theories continued to evolve, and many Americans began to suspect the U.S. government itself of plotting against them. These theories gained more credibility after the revelation of real government conspiracies, notably CIA assassination plots, the Watergate scandal, and the Iran–-Contra affair.
https://oxford.universitypressscholarsh ... chapter-19

User avatar
jdc
Hilda Ogden
Posts: 1925
Joined: Wed Sep 25, 2019 4:31 pm
Location: Your Mum

Re: Conspiracy Theories - A reading list

Post by jdc » Wed Aug 04, 2021 8:11 pm

bjn wrote:
Tue Aug 03, 2021 9:41 pm
The grand parent of them all is surely the Protocols of The Elders of Zion. Deliberately fabricated anti Jewish conspiracy created by the Tsarist police. Many millions taken in over a century since it was was drafted. More propaganda than hoax though.
In terms of age or influence? May be a decent shout if you mean the latter. In terms of age, it's nowt but a pup though.

There's the mediaeval Blood Libel and the 17th century Popish Plot on the religious bigotry theme and these two classics on the theme of mysterious deaths (although even here, there's a mention of an antisemitic CT):
In ancient times, widespread conspiracy theories were circulated pertaining to the death of the Roman emperor Nero, who committed suicide in 68 AD. Some of these theories claimed that Nero had actually faked his death and was secretly still alive, but in hiding, plotting to return and reestablish his reign. In most of these stories, he was said to have fled to the East, where he was still loved and admired.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_c ... ppearances
An early rumor was that Mozart had been poisoned by his colleague Antonio Salieri. However, this has been proven to be untrue because the symptoms displayed by Mozart's illness are not indicative of poisoning. Despite denying the allegation, Salieri was greatly affected by the accusations and widespread public belief that he had contributed to Mozart's death, which contributed to his nervous breakdowns in later life. Beyond the Salieri theory, other theories involving murder by poison have been put forth, blaming the Masons, Jews, or both.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Death_of_ ... e_of_death


I haven't refreshed my memory of this thread so apologies if these have all come up already. Still, even if they have maybe your memory's as bad as mine and you'll not notice any repeats.

User avatar
dyqik
Princess POW
Posts: 7526
Joined: Wed Sep 25, 2019 4:19 pm
Location: Masshole
Contact:

Re: Conspiracy Theories - A reading list

Post by dyqik » Wed Aug 04, 2021 8:42 pm

jdc wrote:
Wed Aug 04, 2021 8:11 pm
bjn wrote:
Tue Aug 03, 2021 9:41 pm
The grand parent of them all is surely the Protocols of The Elders of Zion. Deliberately fabricated anti Jewish conspiracy created by the Tsarist police. Many millions taken in over a century since it was was drafted. More propaganda than hoax though.
In terms of age or influence? May be a decent shout if you mean the latter. In terms of age, it's nowt but a pup though.

There's the mediaeval Blood Libel and the 17th century Popish Plot on the religious bigotry theme and these two classics on the theme of mysterious deaths (although even here, there's a mention of an antisemitic CT):
In ancient times, widespread conspiracy theories were circulated pertaining to the death of the Roman emperor Nero, who committed suicide in 68 AD. Some of these theories claimed that Nero had actually faked his death and was secretly still alive, but in hiding, plotting to return and reestablish his reign. In most of these stories, he was said to have fled to the East, where he was still loved and admired.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_c ... ppearances
An early rumor was that Mozart had been poisoned by his colleague Antonio Salieri. However, this has been proven to be untrue because the symptoms displayed by Mozart's illness are not indicative of poisoning. Despite denying the allegation, Salieri was greatly affected by the accusations and widespread public belief that he had contributed to Mozart's death, which contributed to his nervous breakdowns in later life. Beyond the Salieri theory, other theories involving murder by poison have been put forth, blaming the Masons, Jews, or both.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Death_of_ ... e_of_death


I haven't refreshed my memory of this thread so apologies if these have all come up already. Still, even if they have maybe your memory's as bad as mine and you'll not notice any repeats.
You can probably also count some of the "witches in league with the devil" and "people who fly with elves and kill cattle with elfshot" as conspiracy theory adjacent, even if the head of the conspiracy isn't human, or real.

User avatar
Martin_B
After Pie
Posts: 1614
Joined: Mon Nov 11, 2019 1:20 pm
Location: Perth, WA

Re: Conspiracy Theories - A reading list

Post by Martin_B » Thu Aug 05, 2021 3:34 am

jdc wrote:
Wed Aug 04, 2021 8:11 pm
An early rumor was that Mozart had been poisoned by his colleague Antonio Salieri. However, this has been proven to be untrue because the symptoms displayed by Mozart's illness are not indicative of poisoning. Despite denying the allegation, Salieri was greatly affected by the accusations and widespread public belief that he had contributed to Mozart's death, which contributed to his nervous breakdowns in later life. Beyond the Salieri theory, other theories involving murder by poison have been put forth, blaming the Masons, Jews, or both.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Death_of_ ... e_of_death


I haven't refreshed my memory of this thread so apologies if these have all come up already. Still, even if they have maybe your memory's as bad as mine and you'll not notice any repeats.
Does the theory that Shakespeare didn't exist/didn't write the plays, etc, count as a conspiracy theory? There are theories that all of Shakespeare's plays were written by Marlowe (apparently to keep his cover as a spy, but wouldn't being a writer be a better cover?) or a nobleman (possibly Edward De Vere, because writing plays for the common man wasn't seen as something a nobleman would do) or a mixture of different people who all had their works attributed to Shakespeare (some form of early Alan Smithee).
"My interest is in the future, because I'm going to spend the rest of my life there"

noggins
Snowbonk
Posts: 571
Joined: Wed Nov 13, 2019 1:30 pm

Re: Conspiracy Theories - A reading list

Post by noggins » Thu Aug 05, 2021 10:39 am

Un-Shakespeare isnt a conspiracy theory because it has no consequences - it explains nothing else.

Post Reply