The Invasion of Ukraine

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FlammableFlower
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Re: The Invasion of Ukraine

Post by FlammableFlower » Wed Jul 20, 2022 9:47 pm

jimbob wrote:
Wed Jul 20, 2022 8:46 pm
shpalman wrote:
Wed Jul 20, 2022 6:23 pm
those 50 seconds
Never have I seen a clearer example of a power play by a politician.
Apparently it's revenge for Putin playing the same, much longer trick with Erdoğan in front of the Russian press. To the point Erdoğan sat down thinking he was in for a long wait and then Putin walked in. He's famous for it - made Angela Merkel wait 4 hours... so it's somewhat good to see him on the receiving end.

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Woodchopper
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Re: The Invasion of Ukraine

Post by Woodchopper » Tue Jul 26, 2022 6:57 pm

Business Retreats and Sanctions Are Crippling the Russian Economy
https://papers.ssrn.com/sol3/papers.cfm ... id=4167193

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Re: The Invasion of Ukraine

Post by Woodchopper » Wed Jul 27, 2022 1:55 pm

A good article. Pity that it still needs to be written.
I’m a Ukrainian Socialist. Here’s Why I Resist the Russian Invasion.
https://jacobin.com/2022/07/ukraine-rus ... resistance

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EACLucifer
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Re: The Invasion of Ukraine

Post by EACLucifer » Wed Jul 27, 2022 2:17 pm

Woodchopper wrote:
Wed Jul 27, 2022 1:55 pm
A good article. Pity that it still needs to be written.
I’m a Ukrainian Socialist. Here’s Why I Resist the Russian Invasion.
https://jacobin.com/2022/07/ukraine-rus ... resistance
It took them, what, five months to actually run an article by a Ukrainian?

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Re: The Invasion of Ukraine

Post by monkey » Wed Jul 27, 2022 2:34 pm

EACLucifer wrote:
Wed Jul 27, 2022 2:17 pm
Woodchopper wrote:
Wed Jul 27, 2022 1:55 pm
A good article. Pity that it still needs to be written.
I’m a Ukrainian Socialist. Here’s Why I Resist the Russian Invasion.
https://jacobin.com/2022/07/ukraine-rus ... resistance
It took them, what, five months to actually run an article by a Ukrainian?
Agree with the content or not, a quick search on their website suggests that is not the case.

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EACLucifer
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Re: The Invasion of Ukraine

Post by EACLucifer » Wed Jul 27, 2022 2:44 pm

monkey wrote:
Wed Jul 27, 2022 2:34 pm
EACLucifer wrote:
Wed Jul 27, 2022 2:17 pm
Woodchopper wrote:
Wed Jul 27, 2022 1:55 pm
A good article. Pity that it still needs to be written.


https://jacobin.com/2022/07/ukraine-rus ... resistance
It took them, what, five months to actually run an article by a Ukrainian?
Agree with the content or not, a quick search on their website suggests that is not the case.
You are right. A quick search found a couple of articles either by or partly by Ukrainians, though they lose points for one of them being an interview by Branko Marcetic, whose own articles are paranoid b.llsh.t containing extensive amounts of straight, uncut Kremlin propaganda. They gave that pustulent imbecile rather more articles than all Ukrainians combined so far, as far as I can tell by searching the subject "Ukraine", but I couldn't check the tag itself as apparently that's for subscribers only and the thought of contributing so much as a penny to that pathetic posturing shitrag turns my stomach.

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EACLucifer
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Re: The Invasion of Ukraine

Post by EACLucifer » Fri Jul 29, 2022 10:57 am

There's another video doing the rounds that you do not want to see. I've not seen it, and I'm not going to, but it shows a Russian combatant mutilating a Ukrainian prisoner of war.

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EACLucifer
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Re: The Invasion of Ukraine

Post by EACLucifer » Fri Jul 29, 2022 7:30 pm

The bastards also appear to have murdered several dozen Ukrainian prisoners of war in what, given the location and given the fact that the M31 fragments used to "prove" that Ukraine did it were also photographed in relation to a totally different strike.

1) M31 rockets are in short suppy, and a very accurate, and have only been used so far on high value military targets. A strike on a prisoner of war camp holding Ukrainian prisoners isn't going to be approved. The camp was not near anything else at all.

2) There's chatter on the Russian side indicating that at least some of them think it was their side that did it.

3) Though there's no evidence for it being a Ukrainian strike and some of the "evidence" supplied was clearly fabricated, keeping prisoners of war near the frontlines is a war crime in of itself.

I'm very weary of this. Atrocity after atrocity. They hit a bus queue, too. Civilians killed walking their dogs. Anyone whose end goal doesn't involve the khuilo in chief decorating a lamppost is insufficiently committed at this point.

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Re: The Invasion of Ukraine

Post by jimbob » Fri Jul 29, 2022 8:53 pm

EACLucifer wrote:
Fri Jul 29, 2022 7:30 pm
The bastards also appear to have murdered several dozen Ukrainian prisoners of war in what, given the location and given the fact that the M31 fragments used to "prove" that Ukraine did it were also photographed in relation to a totally different strike.

1) M31 rockets are in short suppy, and a very accurate, and have only been used so far on high value military targets. A strike on a prisoner of war camp holding Ukrainian prisoners isn't going to be approved. The camp was not near anything else at all.

2) There's chatter on the Russian side indicating that at least some of them think it was their side that did it.

3) Though there's no evidence for it being a Ukrainian strike and some of the "evidence" supplied was clearly fabricated, keeping prisoners of war near the frontlines is a war crime in of itself.

I'm very weary of this. Atrocity after atrocity. They hit a bus queue, too. Civilians killed walking their dogs. Anyone whose end goal doesn't involve the khuilo in chief decorating a lamppost is insufficiently committed at this point.
The Russian embassy in the UK has given the lie to that
Have you considered stupidity as an explanation

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Martin Y
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Re: The Invasion of Ukraine

Post by Martin Y » Sat Jul 30, 2022 9:43 am

jimbob wrote:
Fri Jul 29, 2022 8:53 pm
The Russian embassy in the UK has given the lie to that
Unexpected. What have they said? Do you mean "given the lie to" in the sense that they've revealed something which shows the Russian version of the story is a lie?

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EACLucifer
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Re: The Invasion of Ukraine

Post by EACLucifer » Sat Jul 30, 2022 10:05 am

Martin Y wrote:
Sat Jul 30, 2022 9:43 am
jimbob wrote:
Fri Jul 29, 2022 8:53 pm
The Russian embassy in the UK has given the lie to that
Unexpected. What have they said? Do you mean "given the lie to" in the sense that they've revealed something which shows the Russian version of the story is a lie?
They were gleefully calling for POWs from Azov to be killed, claiming they deserved "a humilitating death"

The prisoners of war they appear to have murdered included Azov members - remember, Azov is a regular unit in the Ukrainian armed forces, and far right elements were expelled when the unit was regularised.

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Re: The Invasion of Ukraine

Post by jimbob » Sat Jul 30, 2022 10:19 am

Martin Y wrote:
Sat Jul 30, 2022 9:43 am
jimbob wrote:
Fri Jul 29, 2022 8:53 pm
The Russian embassy in the UK has given the lie to that
Unexpected. What have they said? Do you mean "given the lie to" in the sense that they've revealed something which shows the Russian version of the story is a lie?
I had lost the link, but what EACLucifer says
Have you considered stupidity as an explanation

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Martin Y
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Re: The Invasion of Ukraine

Post by Martin Y » Sat Jul 30, 2022 10:20 am

I guess incitement to murder is just what passes for diplomacy from Russia.

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Sciolus
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Re: The Invasion of Ukraine

Post by Sciolus » Sat Jul 30, 2022 11:25 am

#Azov militants deserve execution, but death not by firing squad but by hanging, because they’re not real soldiers. They deserve a humiliating death.
https://twitter.com/RussianEmbassy/stat ... 7712162828

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EACLucifer
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Re: The Invasion of Ukraine

Post by EACLucifer » Sat Jul 30, 2022 8:20 pm

Sciolus wrote:
Sat Jul 30, 2022 11:25 am
Russian incitement/gloating cut
https://twitter.com/RussianEmbassy/stat ... 7712162828
I can't write about the occupants of that Russian embassy what I would like to write, not here or anywhere else. Suffice to say that they clearly aren't diplomats from their behaviour, which means we should withdraw the protection of the Vienna convention from them. We should return these occupants from the embassy to Russia, and to show our generosity, we should use several aircraft for each individual.

Here's the building, meanwhile.

Image

That's not been hit by an M31. An M31 has a 200lb PBX+fragments warhead. It would not be leaving other buildings untouched. I know this, as I've seen aerial photography of HIMARS strikes.

Some of those who know more about these things, by the way, are suggesting that some of the bodies look like they were dead before they were burned. That's about what I expected, if I'm being honest.

This regime must be destroyed as soon as possible.

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Sciolus
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Re: The Invasion of Ukraine

Post by Sciolus » Sat Jul 30, 2022 8:56 pm

EACLucifer wrote:
Sat Jul 30, 2022 8:20 pm
Sciolus wrote:
Sat Jul 30, 2022 11:25 am
Russian incitement/gloating cut
https://twitter.com/RussianEmbassy/stat ... 7712162828
I understand why you don't like the quote being repeated, but FWIW I got it from the BBC website's most-read article, so in general that ship has sailed.

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EACLucifer
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Re: The Invasion of Ukraine

Post by EACLucifer » Sat Jul 30, 2022 8:58 pm

Sciolus wrote:
Sat Jul 30, 2022 8:56 pm
EACLucifer wrote:
Sat Jul 30, 2022 8:20 pm
I understand why you don't like the quote being repeated, but FWIW I got it from the BBC website's most-read article, so in general that ship has sailed.
I didn't mind you posting it, I just didn't want to post it a second time as once was enough to inform people what they said.

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Re: The Invasion of Ukraine

Post by EACLucifer » Sun Jul 31, 2022 12:28 pm

I don't want to get too ahead of it in terms of concern, but there's quite a lot of Chinese equipment heading coastwards at the moment.

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Re: The Invasion of Ukraine

Post by EACLucifer » Sun Jul 31, 2022 1:03 pm

EACLucifer wrote:
Sun Jul 31, 2022 12:28 pm
I don't want to get too ahead of it in terms of concern, but there's quite a lot of Chinese equipment heading coastwards at the moment.
I realise this reads more alarmingly than I intended it to. I think China's making threats, not about to invade, but there's a few details - like large Ro-Ro ferries being moved off their normal routes - that make it look perhaps like an exercise with the intent of working out how to mobilise for the real thing.

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Woodchopper
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Re: The Invasion of Ukraine

Post by Woodchopper » Sun Jul 31, 2022 1:05 pm

Perhaps best to start a new thread on China and Taiwan.

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bjn
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Re: The Invasion of Ukraine

Post by bjn » Sun Jul 31, 2022 1:54 pm

Links re China?

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EACLucifer
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Re: The Invasion of Ukraine

Post by EACLucifer » Sun Jul 31, 2022 3:04 pm

bjn wrote:
Sun Jul 31, 2022 1:54 pm
Links re China?
Evergreen Intel (@vcdgf555 on twitter) is a good starting point. General chatter mainly.

Will start new thread if there's reason to, or move things to the Fascist China thread, but posted here as some similarities to the buildup we saw last year/early this year around Ukraine, and some elements are related.

For example, there are legitimate concerns about how much GMLRS the US can provide.

And also there are real concerns that the US, by holding back aid for fear of escalation, may be inadvertently encourging Fascist China into thinking the US won't do so much for Free China.

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Re: The Invasion of Ukraine

Post by EACLucifer » Sun Jul 31, 2022 6:41 pm

This one feels more related - member of Serbian governing party claims they may be “forced to start the denazification of the Balkans”, amidst unconfirmed reports of border clashes on the Serbia Kosovo border.

The world's a dangerous place right now. It will be a lot more dangerous if nations start freely invading each other as some of the Russia-Fascist China-Iran aligned states seem to be thinking of doing at the moment - or actually doing in Russia's case, of course*. If Serbia try to restart the Balkan wars, NATO should make a f.cking example of them.


*And Fascist China, for that matter, with their border violations in the Himalayas and preposterous maritime claims. And Iran's use of proxies is notorious.

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Re: The Invasion of Ukraine

Post by jimbob » Mon Aug 01, 2022 6:00 pm

EACLucifer wrote:
Sun Jul 31, 2022 6:41 pm
This one feels more related - member of Serbian governing party claims they may be “forced to start the denazification of the Balkans”, amidst unconfirmed reports of border clashes on the Serbia Kosovo border.

The world's a dangerous place right now. It will be a lot more dangerous if nations start freely invading each other as some of the Russia-Fascist China-Iran aligned states seem to be thinking of doing at the moment - or actually doing in Russia's case, of course*. If Serbia try to restart the Balkan wars, NATO should make a f.cking example of them.


*And Fascist China, for that matter, with their border violations in the Himalayas and preposterous maritime claims. And Iran's use of proxies is notorious.

also this

https://edition.cnn.com/2022/08/01/euro ... /index.htm

Another prominent Russian exile developing sudden "neurological issues"

and the second Bulgarian arms depot owed by Emilian Gebrev has had an explosion "minutes after reporting a breech and unauthorised entry"

Gebrev was poisoned by GRU unit 29155 in 2015 and had a supply depot for Ukraine previously blown up, again by GRU unit 29155

I hope that this time the response is sending longer range weaponry to Ukraine.
Have you considered stupidity as an explanation

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Re: The Invasion of Ukraine

Post by EACLucifer » Mon Aug 01, 2022 7:40 pm

The US don't think the Olenivka prison was hit by HIMARS. They also agree it makes no sense as a target. There were also apparently graves dug before the fire. And the debris fell inward - HIMARS's M31 rockets distribute parts of the buildings across the neighbouring landscape.

So either Russia locked legit prisoners of war in a building and burned it down, or they killed - likely by torture based on previous behaviour - dozens of POWs and burned down the building they were in to try and hide the evidence. Either way, it's an appalling and extremely serious war crime.

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