Poor Brexit outcomes

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Woodchopper
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Re: Poor Brexit outcomes

Post by Woodchopper » Tue Sep 20, 2022 6:31 am


Liz Truss has admitted that a UK-US trade deal, long seen as one of the biggest prizes of Brexit, is not on the horizon, as she arrived in New York on her first overseas trip as prime minister.

Brexit supporters insisted that the 2016 Leave vote would open the way for a free trade agreement with the US, which would dwarf trade deals with countries such as Australia or New Zealand.

But President Joe Biden has made it clear that such a deal was not a priority and on the flight from London to New York, Truss admitted it was not on the agenda.
https://www.ft.com/content/1b0e6267-d46 ... 2532a9abb9

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Re: Poor Brexit outcomes

Post by IvanV » Tue Sep 20, 2022 8:54 am

Woodchopper wrote:
Tue Sep 20, 2022 6:31 am
Liz Truss has admitted that a UK-US trade deal, long seen as one of the biggest prizes of Brexit, is not on the horizon, as she arrived in New York on her first overseas trip as prime minister.

Brexit supporters insisted that the 2016 Leave vote would open the way for a free trade agreement with the US, which would dwarf trade deals with countries such as Australia or New Zealand.
https://www.ft.com/content/1b0e6267-d46 ... 2532a9abb9
And respectable sources such as the FT always said that a major UK-US free trade deal was a fantasy. It was never going to be a priority for a Democratic administration, which would have difficulty getting it past its own party. And if Trump mentioned the availability of a very advantageous deal, it was obvious he was referring to the availability of a deal provided it was very advantageous to the US.

Unfortunately, electorates remain attracted by politicians whose lies are music to their ears, and rarely punishes politicians very much for non-delivery in relation to specific promises. Nor is the exposure of lies a successful political campaigning method.

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Re: Poor Brexit outcomes

Post by Woodchopper » Tue Sep 20, 2022 9:05 am

plodder wrote:
Tue Sep 13, 2022 10:08 am
where I am saying that? I've always said that it'll gradually slide towards a load of fudges, and it looks like that's what's happening. read the article.
That is what's happened.

However, the UK is trying to force the issue with the Northern Ireland Protocol Bill. But now that Truss is in charge perhaps she'll just quietly drop it and return to perpetual fudge.

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Re: Poor Brexit outcomes

Post by plodder » Tue Sep 20, 2022 11:34 am

Woodchopper wrote:
Tue Sep 20, 2022 9:05 am
plodder wrote:
Tue Sep 13, 2022 10:08 am
where I am saying that? I've always said that it'll gradually slide towards a load of fudges, and it looks like that's what's happening. read the article.
That is what's happened.

However, the UK is trying to force the issue with the Northern Ireland Protocol Bill. But now that Truss is in charge perhaps she'll just quietly drop it and return to perpetual fudge.
Both sides are heading in that direction IMO. It’ll rear it’s head now and again if anyone wants a good headline (from either side) and then it’ll get ignored again for a bit.

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Re: Poor Brexit outcomes

Post by plodder » Thu Oct 06, 2022 4:35 pm


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Re: Poor Brexit outcomes

Post by Opti » Thu Oct 06, 2022 4:55 pm

This one rumbles on ... and on.

British driving licence holders had to register their intent to exchange driving licences aaages ago. Most did, some missed the deadline. Everyone who emigrated to Spain after the transition with a Brit driving licence knew when moving that no agreement had been made to exchange their UK licence, but thousands have sat tight hoping for a favourable outcome from negotiations. Their hope has been misplaced for aaaages now, there's still no agreement despite the Brit Embassy making soothing noises for about a year. Doesn't stop them moaning. It should have been part of their decision making before emigrating.

Many say "I've been driving for forty years, It would be hard to pass the Spanish test". I suggest that if they think they can't pass the test they're quite likely not to be safe to drive. But thousands are holding out "on principle".

The conspiracy theory is that it's all about Gibraltar, it's much more likely that Spain are insisting on access to the DVLA database.

Naturally I exchanged my UK licence well before the deadline.
Time for a big fat one.

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Re: Poor Brexit outcomes

Post by Woodchopper » Thu Oct 06, 2022 5:06 pm

Opti wrote:
Thu Oct 06, 2022 4:55 pm

Many say "I've been driving for forty years, It would be hard to pass the Spanish test". I suggest that if they think they can't pass the test they're quite likely not to be safe to drive. But thousands are holding out "on principle".
The article in The Express does state that the test would be in Spanish. I’m assuming that there’s a written test. If so some people may not be able to understand the questions even if they would know the answers in English.

Though they are w.nkers for not getting it organised earlier

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Re: Poor Brexit outcomes

Post by bolo » Thu Oct 06, 2022 5:13 pm

Woodchopper wrote:
Thu Oct 06, 2022 5:06 pm
The article in The Express does state that the test would be in Spanish. I’m assuming that there’s a written test. If so some people may not be able to understand the questions even if they would know the answers in English.
I wonder how many of them used to complain about immigrants to the UK not learning the local language.

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Re: Poor Brexit outcomes

Post by Opti » Thu Oct 06, 2022 5:16 pm

Woodchopper wrote:
Thu Oct 06, 2022 5:06 pm

The article in The Express does state that the test would be in Spanish. I’m assuming that there’s a written test. If so some people may not be able to understand the questions even if they would know the answers in English.
There is an option to take the written test in English. The practical test is conducted in Spanish - but the instructions from the examiner are simple and well known. Every driving school will coach you to the level of Spanish necessary. The biggest obstacles as far as the refuseniks are concerned are, a) the UK allows Spanish licence holders to exchange to a UK one so it's "not fair"* and b) that tests can only be booked by a driving school, in effect meaning that some lessons are mandatory.

* Sovereignty is what Brexit was supposed to be about. ;)
Time for a big fat one.

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Re: Poor Brexit outcomes

Post by IvanV » Thu Oct 06, 2022 5:22 pm

Opti wrote:
Thu Oct 06, 2022 4:55 pm
But thousands are holding out "on principle".
Could you advise what principle they have in mind? The "cake and eat it" principle? Or the "I didn't vote for it so it doesn't affect me" principle?

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Re: Poor Brexit outcomes

Post by Opti » Thu Oct 06, 2022 5:43 pm

IvanV wrote:
Thu Oct 06, 2022 5:22 pm
Opti wrote:
Thu Oct 06, 2022 4:55 pm
But thousands are holding out "on principle".
Could you advise what principle they have in mind? The "cake and eat it" principle? Or the "I didn't vote for it so it doesn't affect me" principle?
It's the "cake and eat it" tendency, mostly. Again, not realising the possible implications of leaving the EU. The number who genuinely got caught out by not coordinating their deadline dates are fairly small. It's mostly recent Brit immigrants that are moaning. There was plenty of notice given that UK licences wouldn't be accepted post-transition, so anyone living here before the end of transition only had about 3 years notice. I've no sympathy for those who couldn't be bothered to swap when they could.
Time for a big fat one.

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Re: Poor Brexit outcomes

Post by veravista » Fri Oct 07, 2022 7:27 pm

Flew home from Madeira last Monday. About 12 flights leaving within a few hours, 4 of them to the UK (600 ish passengers) and the rest to EU/shengen zone.

This was the passport check to get our stamps. The woman in red was muttering and moaning about how they should be let through without checks and what right had they etc etc.. EU passports/ID to the right, 'others' to the left (the queue went into a snake by the barrier thingies so the line didn't go up the stairs).

I laughed.
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Re: Poor Brexit outcomes

Post by Cardinal Fang » Wed Oct 12, 2022 1:01 pm

veravista wrote:
Fri Oct 07, 2022 7:27 pm

This was the passport check to get our stamps. The woman in red was muttering and moaning about how they should be let through without checks and what right had they etc etc.. EU passports/ID to the right, 'others' to the left (the queue went into a snake by the barrier thingies so the line didn't go up the stairs).
I hope you asked how how she voted in the Brexit referendum

CF
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Re: Poor Brexit outcomes

Post by veravista » Wed Oct 12, 2022 2:38 pm

I don't think I needed to!

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Re: Poor Brexit outcomes

Post by jimbob » Sat Oct 15, 2022 9:16 pm

https://www.telegraph.co.uk/business/20 ... ght-along/

The Telegraph saying that Project Fear was right all along and possibly underestimated the cost
Have you considered stupidity as an explanation

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Re: Poor Brexit outcomes

Post by lpm » Sat Oct 15, 2022 9:24 pm

That's not "The Telegraph". It's just a comment piece from one of their remoaners.
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Re: Poor Brexit outcomes

Post by Grumble » Tue Oct 18, 2022 2:49 pm

Woodchopper wrote:
Tue Sep 20, 2022 9:05 am
plodder wrote:
Tue Sep 13, 2022 10:08 am
where I am saying that? I've always said that it'll gradually slide towards a load of fudges, and it looks like that's what's happening. read the article.
That is what's happened.

However, the UK is trying to force the issue with the Northern Ireland Protocol Bill. But now that Truss is in charge perhaps she'll just quietly drop it and return to perpetual fudge.
I’m not optimistic about at least some of the content of this post
where once I used to scintillate
now I sin till ten past three

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Re: Poor Brexit outcomes

Post by shpalman » Sun Nov 13, 2022 1:31 pm

having that swing is a necessary but not sufficient condition for it meaning a thing
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Re: Poor Brexit outcomes

Post by shpalman » Sun Dec 11, 2022 10:55 am

Black EU citizen with settled status temporarily denied entry into UK
Dahaba Ali Hussen, a Dutch citizen of Somali origin who has lived in London for 19 years, was on a solo holiday in France when she arrived at the Gare du Nord railway station two hours before her train was set to depart to London St Pancras.

Unable to pass the barriers for the EU queue, Hussen assumed there was a technology issue. She claims a UK Border Force officer she then approached confiscated her passport after he notified her that she would be subject to “further checks” because she had been denied settled status in the past.
https://twitter.com/Dahabaalihussen/sta ... gBVzA&s=19
having that swing is a necessary but not sufficient condition for it meaning a thing
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Re: Poor Brexit outcomes

Post by shpalman » Tue Jan 17, 2023 6:14 pm

UK battery start-up Britishvolt has collapsed into administration

Its collapse is not the poor outcome of Brexit. Its very existence was a poor outcome of Brexit:
Fmrvcp9XgAAcZV8.png
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having that swing is a necessary but not sufficient condition for it meaning a thing
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Re: Poor Brexit outcomes

Post by jimbob » Mon Feb 06, 2023 2:52 pm

Oh noes the Daily Mail has provided a series of difficult questions for rejoiners

https://www.dailymail.co.uk/columnists/ ... party.html
Last week, on the third anniversary of our departure from the EU, a survey found that some 57 per cent of Britons were now in favour of rejoining.

And little wonder! Those who we could once dismiss as ‘Remoaners’ have, in recent years, quietly morphed into something even more insidious: ‘Rejoiners.’ Every day, they tell us that Brexit has failed, defying the facts. And they think if they repeat this mantra often enough, people will believe it.

1) If we rejoined the EU, how much would Britain pay into its budget per year?

2) If free movement into the UK from the EU were to be restored, what would annual net migration be?

3) What proportion of the global economy, and of British trade, will the EU represent in 20 years?

4) What would be the effect on future trade of abandoning our new, closer ties with the growing Pacific region?

5) What would be the economic cost of joining the eurozone?

6) Will the UK rejoin the Common Fisheries Policy?

7) As we now have a Free Trade Agreement with the EU, what precisely would be the advantage of rejoining the Single Market and Customs Union?

8) Would Brussels lawmakers have priority over Parliament, and would the European Court of Justice be superior to British courts?

9) Would Rejoiners agree to the EU being in overall charge of our foreign and security policy?

10) Would Rejoiners commit to a referendum to approve the terms negotiated for a new relationship with the EU?
Have you considered stupidity as an explanation

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Re: Poor Brexit outcomes

Post by Opti » Mon Feb 06, 2023 4:07 pm

jimbob wrote:
Mon Feb 06, 2023 2:52 pm
Oh noes the Daily Mail has provided a series of difficult questions for rejoiners

https://www.dailymail.co.uk/columnists/ ... party.html

Sez Robert Tombs, dual English/French passport holder.
Time for a big fat one.

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Re: Poor Brexit outcomes

Post by TopBadger » Mon Feb 06, 2023 5:30 pm

10) made me spit my water out...

How f.cking laughable - we didn't get a referendum on the terms of us leaving (which probably would have been rejected) so why the hell does he think it's appropriate to get one on rejoining?

The fact is - we already had the best of all worlds - and we ditched it. We're unlikely to get back in on the same terms as we left.
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Re: Poor Brexit outcomes

Post by nekomatic » Mon Feb 06, 2023 8:22 pm

TopBadger wrote:
Mon Feb 06, 2023 5:30 pm
How f.cking laughable - we didn't get a referendum on the terms of us leaving (which probably would have been rejected) so why the hell does he think it's appropriate to get one on rejoining?
Well because that’s the way we wanted to do things, so it would be hypocritical of us not to keep to that principle. Obvs. 🙄

The ten questions are fair enough, to be honest, aside from a couple of bits of sneaky wording which are easily challenged (‘new, closer ties with the Pacific region’ lol), and not at all difficult. It’s his answers that are bollocks.
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Re: Poor Brexit outcomes

Post by jimbob » Tue Feb 07, 2023 5:35 pm

John Major states the obvious

https://www.theguardian.com/politics/20 ... dApp_Other
John Major has launched a scathing attack on Boris Johnson’s handling of Brexit, saying his administration agreed to the Northern Ireland protocol despite knowing it was unworkable.

“That must be the first agreement in history that was signed by people who decided it was useless in the first place,” Major told a Westminster committee on Tuesday
Have you considered stupidity as an explanation

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