Trump Assassination Attempt

[Martin_B]

Are we sure that all these attempts aren't coming from JD Vance?

I think he just has to sit back. If Trump wins he won't last 4 years at his rate of decline.

[Grumble]

Oh how things might have been.

[noggins]

Are we sure that all these attempts aren't coming from JD Vance?

I predict: Trump will not see out his full term. He will hand over to Vance in return for a full pardon.

[lpm]

Oh how things might have been.

The most interesting counterfactual is Hilary Clinton winning narrowly in 2016.

She'd have faced unbelievable abuse and obstruction for 4 years, then be thrown into Covid with the country unmanageable. Just imagine her trying to bring in pandemic restrictions, with Republican Presidential Candidate for the Nov 2020 election being Trump. The rejection of vaccines would have been one of Trump's weapons. God knows how many extra people would have died.

Trump would have won in 2020.

Then he would face the inflation spike, the Ukraine invasion, and possibly triggered an even worse Gaza. Would he be reelected in 2024? Maybe not.

[Stranger Mouse]

Are we sure that all these attempts aren't coming from JD Vance?

I predict: Trump will not see out his full term. He will hand over to Vance in return for a full pardon.

With a servile Supreme Court and the ability to meddle behind the scenes with intimidation I doubt if that will be required for him to get off scot free

[dyqik]

Oh how things might have been.

The most interesting counterfactual is Hilary Clinton winning narrowly in 2016.

She'd have faced unbelievable abuse and obstruction for 4 years, then be thrown into Covid with the country unmanageable. Just imagine her trying to bring in pandemic restrictions, with Republican Presidential Candidate for the Nov 2020 election being Trump. The rejection of vaccines would have been one of Trump's weapons. God knows how many extra people would have died.

Trump would have won in 2020.

Then he would face the inflation spike, the Ukraine invasion, and possibly triggered an even worse Gaza. Would he be reelected in 2024? Maybe not.

Trump staying in power in 2020 with some safeguards still in place, and losing the House and Senate in 2022 is probably the best possible outcome that might have been.

[Sciolus]

Are we sure that all these attempts aren't coming from JD Vance?

I predict: Trump will not see out his full term. He will hand over to Vance in return for a full pardon.

With a servile Supreme Court and the ability to meddle behind the scenes with intimidation I doubt if that will be required for him to get off scot free

Yeah. Trump is now supreme dictator, with immunity from constitution and laws. The system of checks and balances is in his own control. Anyone who challenges him will get sacked and replaced with a lickspittle.

It's baffling, but although I said he was incompetent on the other thread, he does have one exceptional skill, and that is getting people to give him what he wants. He just got 72 million people to give him what he wants. He has plenty of people ready to do whatever it takes.

The only question is how much control his puppetmasters really have.

[Grumble]

He doesn’t have puppet masters. He has mega donors, but that’s not really the same thing.

[Chris Preston]

Are we sure that all these attempts aren't coming from JD Vance?

I predict: Trump will not see out his full term. He will hand over to Vance in return for a full pardon.

The only way Trump won't see out his term is for him to be completely incapacitated or die. There is no way he will resign. Trump needs to be the centre of attention. We saw that in his first term where he kept having rallies well before there was a need to run for re-election.

More likely Trump will pre-emptively pardon himself, change the term limits so he can run again, or declare himself President for life. Trump believes he owns the Supreme Court (and they really haven't done much to disabuse him of this idea) so he doesn't have to fear there will be consequences to anything he does while President. Besides, he is going to put all those who have been prosecuting cases against him in jail.

Trump has a history of surrounding himself with people who give him re-enforcement of his crazy ideas and after a bit of this they become solidified in his head as reality.

[Fishnut]

Don't forget, the supreme court has also made it that the president can't be prosecuted for anything. There's really nothing restraining him.

[Chris Preston]

Don't forget, the supreme court has also made it that the president can't be prosecuted for anything. There's really nothing restraining him.

Well no.

There is a DOJ tradition that the President is not prosecuted while in office. Lawsuits brought by individuals are fine.

The Supreme Court confirmed that a President could not be prosecuted after their term for an "official act" while President. We just don't know what the real definition of an official act is. Trump will claim his attempts to overturn the election in 2020 were official acts as President. I would view them as personal acts, given the President has no role in the running of elections. The Supreme Court will probably now not rule on this because of my point above.

The restraints on Trump's desires in his first term were all because people stood up to him and told him he couldn't do what he proposed. Trump has indicated he does not want this happening in his second term, but it remains to be seen whether there is bureaucratic or judicial pushback and whether Trump could be bothered focusing enough attention to get his way.

[dyqik]

Don't forget, the supreme court has also made it that the president can't be prosecuted for anything. There's really nothing restraining him.

Well no.

There is a DOJ tradition that the President is not prosecuted while in office. Lawsuits brought by individuals are fine.

The Supreme Court confirmed that a President could not be prosecuted after their term for an "official act" while President. We just don't know what the real definition of an official act is. Trump will claim his attempts to overturn the election in 2020 were official acts as President. I would view them as personal acts, given the President has no role in the running of elections. The Supreme Court will probably now not rule on this because of my point above.

They also said that there is a presumption of immunity for other acts committed while in office, so that any other prosecution would essentially have to be cleared by Supreme Court first.

[lpm]

The DOJ will end it's prosecutions.

The Georgia case will also be dropped due to pressure. If not then Trump will declare he's terminated it and see whether they'll take it to the Supreme Court.

He will pardon Bannon for the state charges on the Build the Wall scam - to see if the Supreme Court will rule that Prsidents supercede state law.

The New York judge will give him a fine. He will refuse to pay it. All Court rulings will be ignored and his lawyers will argue he is immune from contempt of Court.

He won't prosecute his enemies. He'll fire them, cancel their pensions, etc.

[Stranger Mouse]

The DOJ will end it's prosecutions.

The Georgia case will also be dropped due to pressure. If not then Trump will declare he's terminated it and see whether they'll take it to the Supreme Court.

He will pardon Bannon for the state charges on the Build the Wall scam - to see if the Supreme Court will rule that Prsidents supercede state law.

The New York judge will give him a fine. He will refuse to pay it. All Court rulings will be ignored and his lawyers will argue he is immune from contempt of Court.

He won't prosecute his enemies. He'll fire them, cancel their pensions, etc.

I agree with the majority of this. With regard to the last paragraph I think that IRS investigations will be opened into many of his enemies as happened with James Comey last time.

The only think I disagree with is that I think he will select a few people for trumped up criminal charges so that he can use similar to threaten others to obtain compliance (as he tried in Georgia).

I also expect we will see Putin style assassinations become the norm in the future. I doubt if he’ll leave it just to his nuttier followers to carry out harassment and acts of violence.

ETA just realised. If he does start knocking people off Putin style I suppose we don’t need to change the thread title to talk about that unless he succeeds.

[headshot]

Has E Jean Carroll been paid anything yet?

[philbo]

Just noticed this.. it amused

Screenshot_20241110-230647_Brave.jpg (39.99 KiB) Viewed 1471 times

[headshot]

Just noticed this.. it amused
Screenshot_20241110-230647_Brave.jpg

I hope no-one was within earshot.

[IvanV]

Has E Jean Carroll been paid anything yet?

She has not received anything yet.

Trump posted a bond so he could have an appeal. That appeal was heard in September.

We are now awaiting a judgment. I don't know if there are any subsequent appeals possible by either party if they don't like the outcome of this one.

There would appear to be nothing Trump can do to stop Carroll getting the money if he loses and has no more appeals, as he has posted a bond into the court - the court would call the bond and pay out to Carroll. But it is possible that the bond isn't good, as he tried hard to post a bad one. But Trump being Trump, about to become president again, and having a supreme court in his pocket, it wouldn't surprise anyone if he tried to find some dictatorial way of stopping the payout.

[Al Capone Junior]

I am so embarrassed to be an American. I want to emigrate to somewhere less f.cked up. However I doubt any sane countries are even taking American applicants anymore. And who can blame them.

We've recreated the Third Reich almost perfectly. Americana Uber-Alles.

Who will be given the part that corresponds to being a Jew in Germany in 1939? When will the violence start? Will the new Hitler just stuff the constitution in the toilet on day one?

The US and the world are seriously f.cked, to the thunderous applause of the idiots who elected these evil men to our highest offices.

Hoping for a large asteroid to put us out of everyone's misery

[Martin Y]

... Who will be given the part that corresponds to being a Jew in Germany in 1939?

Well it certainly looks like immigrants are in those crosshairs, whether they're the illegals a chunk of the economy depends on or the Haitians people fear might eat their pets. When the undocumented are required to wear a coloured symbol on their clothes you'll know for sure.

[Al Capone Junior]

suicide of a nation
Short and to the point and totally correct

[Gfamily]

suicide of a nation
Short and to the point and totally correct

Fixed Link

[TopBadger]

I am so embarrassed to be an American. I want to emigrate to somewhere less f.cked up. However I doubt any sane countries are even taking American applicants anymore. And who can blame them.

We've recreated the Third Reich almost perfectly. Americana Uber-Alles.

Who will be given the part that corresponds to being a Jew in Germany in 1939? When will the violence start? Will the new Hitler just stuff the constitution in the toilet on day one?

The US and the world are seriously f.cked, to the thunderous applause of the idiots who elected these evil men to our highest offices.

Hoping for a large asteroid to put us out of everyone's misery

I thought the same thing watching "Lee" - new Kate Winslet film at the weekend. Her character describes the rise of the Nazi's and during that it occurred to me that History could be about to repeat itself. Lets hope what remains of the "checks and balances" stops the US teetering over the edge.

[bjn]

What checks and balances are out of the hands of the crazies?

I’m honestly expecting death squads within two years.

[Woodchopper]

I am so embarrassed to be an American. I want to emigrate to somewhere less f.cked up. However I doubt any sane countries are even taking American applicants anymore. And who can blame them.

We've recreated the Third Reich almost perfectly. Americana Uber-Alles.

Who will be given the part that corresponds to being a Jew in Germany in 1939? When will the violence start? Will the new Hitler just stuff the constitution in the toilet on day one?

The US and the world are seriously f.cked, to the thunderous applause of the idiots who elected these evil men to our highest offices.

Hoping for a large asteroid to put us out of everyone's misery

I thought the same thing watching "Lee" - new Kate Winslet film at the weekend. Her character describes the rise of the Nazi's and during that it occurred to me that History could be about to repeat itself. Lets hope what remains of the "checks and balances" stops the US teetering over the edge.

IMHO people should try to learn a lot more lessons from history. The Nazis were a very extreme form of authoritarianism who existed in pretty unique times (limited history of democracy, hyper inflation and depression, nation lost a world war and was stripped of its empire etc). What is much more common is the consolidation of power among an individual or clique which erodes democracy and the rule of law and replaces it with corrupt politics based upon patronage. People should be more worried about the US following the example set by Erdogan, Oban or Berlusconi than by Hitler.