After Corbyn

[shpalman]

I seem to remember that at end of the labour government, which had Gordon Brown in charge of it rather than Blair, the news was the MP's big-house-mortgages-on-expenses scandal.

If anyone is remembering Tony Blair losing an election because of the Iraq War they are suffering from a Mandela effect.

[Gfamily]

IME, Iraq is mentioned by Labour leftists and LibDems, but not by people who
a) are pro Brexit rightists
b) anti Brexit Labour supporters

[plodder]

I note that, almost a week after the election result, we still haven’t seen an apology from Tony Blair.

[GeenDienst]

Suggest a small amendment:

IME, Iraq is mentioned by Labour leftists and LibDems, but not by people who
a) are pro Brexit rightists
b) anti Brexit Labour supporters any f.cker else

Of minor passing interest, there's a really odd piece by the Groans here, maintaining that the LDs supported the Iraq war by voting against it. Something about not being out and out pacifists, and hoping the troops all didn't get killed once it started.

[El Pollo Diablo]

Just heard that out of 54 former English Labour seats lost 51 voted leave in 2016. Still think I'm wrong...?

Yep.

[GeenDienst]

I note that, almost a week after the election result, we still haven’t seen an apology from Tony Blair.

Or Lord Buckethead. Or that bloke I saw in Sainsbury's.

[Martin Y]

IME, Iraq is mentioned by Labour leftists and LibDems, but not by people who
a) are pro Brexit rightists
b) anti Brexit Labour supporters

That's my impression. Also Iraq is the go-to stick to beat Blair, not Labour generally.

[GeenDienst]

Labour supporters who aren't anti-Brexit are generally lexiters, and this is confounded with leftiness.

[Herainestold]

Need a stealth candidate. Any Labour leader with the leftish, progressive, anti-Imperialist crdentials of Corbyn will draw the attention of the Establishment, the Americans, the Russians, the media, the banksters, Koch Bros, et al. That hypothetical person, like Corbyn will have no chance.
Need to find somebody whoo looks moderate but has deep progressive and leftish instincts and who will pivot that way once elected.

Don't know who that is, or how that is accomplished but it is whats needed.

[GeenDienst]

Right, another liar, then.

[monkey]

Need a stealth candidate. Any Labour leader with the leftish, progressive, anti-Imperialist crdentials of Corbyn will draw the attention of the Establishment, the Americans, the Russians, the media, the banksters, Koch Bros, et al. That hypothetical person, like Corbyn will have no chance.
Need to find somebody whoo looks moderate but has deep progressive and leftish instincts and who will pivot that way once elected.

Don't know who that is, or how that is accomplished but it is whats needed.

If you knew who they were, they'd be failing at stealth.

[bolo]

Need to find somebody whoo looks moderate but has deep progressive and leftish instincts and who will pivot that way once elected.

So somebody who gets elected by promising A then actually does B? This would be a good thing?

[dyqik]

Need to find somebody whoo looks moderate but has deep progressive and leftish instincts and who will pivot that way once elected.

So somebody who gets elected by promising A then actually does B? This would be a good thing?

A better option would be someone who is moderate, and can work with existing institutions, but backed by a party policy book that is progressive and leftist. That way there's not so much of the worry that they will blow up the system or destroy what people have already won, but the left still trusts the aims of the party they lead.

[FredM]

Clive Lewis announced today that he’s definitely standing. I doubt that he believes he can win tho’.

[GeenDienst]

Seems he believes the problem is that Labour aren't Momentumy enough.

[Iron Magpie]

Right, another liar, then.

Yes absolutely. Why not? The tories have been doing this successfully for years. It's about time Labour started doing the same. As Corbyn pointed out after the queens speech the tories have already backed out of three of their election lies...ahem...commitments. All inside a week.

[GeenDienst]

So Labour squeaks in with a small majority, with, maybe 26% of the electorate having voted for them,* on a promise of something no more than moderately leftie.

And then, "Aha! April, May, June, July and August fool! What you're really getting is a full-on, radical socialist transformation of society!"

I'd give them about three weeks.

And this of course is entirely separate to the stuff about Labour apparently being better than that.

*Based roughly on Cameron's 2015 win.

[sheldrake]

I find it comical that people believe Corbyn told the truth more than Boris Johnson. I know he had a puritanical 'too honest for his own good' myth going within the labour party, but to outsiders he was obviously a deeply self-deluded and mendacious person who just scowled and walked off whenever he was caught out talking nonsense.

The only difference between them is that Johnson is more positive and entertaining, and has a much better grasp of what people outside of his own political tradition think about life.

The current choices seem to consist of momentum stooges or continuity remainers who think the election result was just down to Corbyn's personality and some conspiracy theory about Russia.

Yup, Labour is looking at a long winter away from power.

[PeteB]

I agree - it would be difficult to turn round that majority in 1 term. I think it depends a bit how affected the economy is and how much people notice, especially is we leave end of December next year, with whatever can be negotiated in that time. EU / US Level playing field conditions will be interesting

[Iron Magpie]

I find it comical that people believe Corbyn told the truth more than Boris Johnson. I know he had a puritanical 'too honest for his own good' myth going within the labour party, but to outsiders he was obviously a deeply self-deluded and mendacious person who just scowled and walked off whenever he was caught out talking nonsense.

The only difference between them is that Johnson is more positive and entertaining, and has a much better grasp of what people outside of his own political tradition think about life.

The current choices seem to consist of momentum stooges or continuity remainers who think the election result was just down to Corbyn's personality and some conspiracy theory about Russia.

Yup, Labour is looking at a long winter away from power.

Wow. This has to be the most bonkers thing I've read in this new place.
The difference between them is nothing like what you wrote. The differences are many but on truth telling the difference is that Bozo has been sacked from two jobs for telling dirty great porkies and Corbyn hasn't...ever.

[Iron Magpie]

Glad you also brought up those conspiracy theories about Russia
Any idea when we are going to get a look at the report that the government have been hiding since before the election? No...thought not.

[murmur]

I find it comical that people believe Corbyn told the truth more than Boris Johnson. I know he had a puritanical 'too honest for his own good' myth going within the labour party, but to outsiders he was obviously a deeply self-deluded and mendacious person who just scowled and walked off whenever he was caught out talking nonsense.

The only difference between them is that Johnson is more positive and entertaining, and has a much better grasp of what people outside of his own political tradition think about life.

The current choices seem to consist of momentum stooges or continuity remainers who think the election result was just down to Corbyn's personality and some conspiracy theory about Russia.

Yup, Labour is looking at a long winter away from power.

Wow. This has to be the most bonkers thing I've read in this new place.
The difference between them is nothing like what you wrote. The differences are many but on truth telling the difference is that Bozo has been sacked from two jobs for telling dirty great porkies and Corbyn hasn't...ever.

Welcome to Sheldrake World, official language Newspeak.

[sheldrake]

I find it comical that people believe Corbyn told the truth more than Boris Johnson. I know he had a puritanical 'too honest for his own good' myth going within the labour party, but to outsiders he was obviously a deeply self-deluded and mendacious person who just scowled and walked off whenever he was caught out talking nonsense.

The only difference between them is that Johnson is more positive and entertaining, and has a much better grasp of what people outside of his own political tradition think about life.

The current choices seem to consist of momentum stooges or continuity remainers who think the election result was just down to Corbyn's personality and some conspiracy theory about Russia.

Yup, Labour is looking at a long winter away from power.

Wow. This has to be the most bonkers thing I've read in this new place.
The difference between them is nothing like what you wrote. The differences are many but on truth telling the difference is that Bozo has been sacked from two jobs for telling dirty great porkies and Corbyn hasn't...ever.

That's because Corbyn haa never had a real job outside of politics. Corbyn has lied repeatedly.

[Iron Magpie]

^^^^surely has to be worth a double facepalm. Try reading something other than the Daily Mail and you will find that isn't true. Now I understand why you think Boris and JC have things in common re truth telling. You wouldn't recognise the truth if it stood up in your soup.

[sheldrake]

Would you lie to explain why Corbyn stopped telling the truth about his views on Brexit ?
His repeated lies on TV about antisemitism in the Labour party, outed by members of his own party ?