Boris Johnson is an idiot - irish bridge edition

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JQH
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Re: Boris Johnson is an idiot - irish bridge edition

Post by JQH » Wed Feb 12, 2020 5:19 pm

Gfamily wrote:
Tue Feb 11, 2020 11:49 pm
It's been an interesting derail that has taught me that Radon was also known as Thoron and Actinon as it wasn't immediately clear that the same chemical was emitted from Radium, Thorium and Actinium.
There was, I believe, a proposal that the element be renamed "Emanon" but that seems tp have been abandoned.
And remember that if you botch the exit, the carnival of reaction may be coming to a town near you.

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Re: Boris Johnson is an idiot - irish bridge edition

Post by Gfamily » Wed Feb 12, 2020 5:23 pm

JQH wrote:
Wed Feb 12, 2020 5:19 pm
Gfamily wrote:
Tue Feb 11, 2020 11:49 pm
It's been an interesting derail that has taught me that Radon was also known as Thoron and Actinon as it wasn't immediately clear that the same chemical was emitted from Radium, Thorium and Actinium.
There was, I believe, a proposal that the element be renamed "Emanon" but that seems tp have been abandoned.
I could have gone with Emanamnium.
My avatar was a scientific result that was later found to be 'mistaken' - I rarely claim to be 100% correct
ETA 5/8/20: I've been advised that the result was correct, it was the initial interpretation that needed to be withdrawn
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Re: Boris Johnson is an idiot - irish bridge edition

Post by Trinucleus » Sat Feb 15, 2020 10:26 am

As they pointed out on the Last Leg, he didn't even manage to build a bridge from North London to South London

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Re: Boris Johnson is an idiot - irish bridge edition

Post by JQH » Mon Feb 17, 2020 12:08 pm

Trinucleus wrote:
Sat Feb 15, 2020 10:26 am
As they pointed out on the Last Leg, he didn't even manage to build a bridge from North London to South London
And he still managed to spend £50million on it.
And remember that if you botch the exit, the carnival of reaction may be coming to a town near you.

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Re: Boris Johnson is an idiot - irish bridge edition

Post by Blackcountryboy » Mon Feb 17, 2020 12:24 pm

Perhaps we have got Boris wrong all these years; his main ambition isn’t to be Prime Minister but to open a bridge. Becoming Mayor of London and Prime Minister is just a means to an end.

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Re: Boris Johnson is an idiot - irish bridge edition

Post by Gfamily » Mon Feb 17, 2020 12:29 pm

Blackcountryboy wrote:
Mon Feb 17, 2020 12:24 pm
Perhaps we have got Boris wrong all these years; his main ambition isn’t to be Prime Minister but to open a bridge. Becoming Mayor of London and Prime Minister is just a means to an end.
Two ends, otherwise it's just a pier.
My avatar was a scientific result that was later found to be 'mistaken' - I rarely claim to be 100% correct
ETA 5/8/20: I've been advised that the result was correct, it was the initial interpretation that needed to be withdrawn
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Re: Boris Johnson is an idiot - irish bridge edition

Post by FlammableFlower » Mon Feb 17, 2020 2:09 pm

Gfamily wrote:
Mon Feb 17, 2020 12:29 pm
Blackcountryboy wrote:
Mon Feb 17, 2020 12:24 pm
Perhaps we have got Boris wrong all these years; his main ambition isn’t to be Prime Minister but to open a bridge. Becoming Mayor of London and Prime Minister is just a means to an end.
Two ends, otherwise it's just a pier.
If only it was and he could take a long walk...

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Re: Boris Johnson is an idiot - irish bridge edition

Post by individualmember » Mon Feb 17, 2020 8:15 pm

All of a sudden this bridge idea doesn’t seem so bonkers after all. https://www.independent.co.uk/environme ... 33136.html

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Re: Boris Johnson is an idiot - irish bridge edition

Post by AMS » Fri Mar 06, 2020 5:20 pm

The front page of today's Torygraph is talking about a tunnel from Portpatrick to Larne. Apparently this could be built within 10 years.

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Re: Boris Johnson is an idiot - irish bridge edition

Post by Martin Y » Fri Mar 06, 2020 6:15 pm

AMS wrote:
Fri Mar 06, 2020 5:20 pm
The front page of today's Torygraph is talking about a tunnel from Portpatrick to Larne. Apparently this could be built within 10 years.
Tunnel under the million tons of mouldering bombs? That sounds fine.

Of course once the good people of Northern Ireland emerge from the tunnel, they'll be in Portpatrick, which is very pretty but it's f.cking nowhere. The really political decision is whether the corresponding road upgrade is built on the assumption traffic is going to head South into England or North to central Scotland; whether it's assumed the UK will have broken up and the tunnel will be a link in a Celtic/EU encirclement of Fortress England (and Wales).

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Re: Boris Johnson is an idiot - irish bridge edition

Post by Little waster » Fri Mar 06, 2020 6:32 pm

Martin Y wrote:
Fri Mar 06, 2020 6:15 pm
AMS wrote:
Fri Mar 06, 2020 5:20 pm
The front page of today's Torygraph is talking about a tunnel from Portpatrick to Larne. Apparently this could be built within 10 years.
Tunnel under the million tons of mouldering bombs? That sounds fine.
Explosions go upwards, that's right isn't it?


Unless some of the bombs are upside-down! :shock:

Somebody should probably go down there and check, can I nominate ... absolutely anybody from the Cabinet.
Shamelessly recycling old jokes since 1952.

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Re: Boris Johnson is an idiot - irish bridge edition

Post by murmur » Fri Mar 06, 2020 6:35 pm

AMS wrote:
Fri Mar 06, 2020 5:20 pm
The front page of today's Torygraph is talking about a tunnel from Portpatrick to Larne. Apparently this could be built within 10 years.
Just listen to Plodder: don't tell the Scottish Secretary about any possible snags with this and just get yer tea spoons out and start digging! The boss is always right!
It's so much more attractive inside the moral kiosk

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Re: Boris Johnson is an idiot - irish bridge edition

Post by plebian » Fri Mar 06, 2020 6:46 pm

IIRC the tunnel ideas under the Irish sea are all more complex because of the depth and strata. Oh and length. The Chunnel is a doddle at 20miles, not too deep.

The only vaguely engineered option I've seen, ahem, floating about was a sunken tunnel of prefabbed, popped in a trench.
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Re: Boris Johnson is an idiot - irish bridge edition

Post by Bird on a Fire » Fri Mar 06, 2020 6:56 pm

Little waster wrote:
Fri Mar 06, 2020 6:32 pm
Martin Y wrote:
Fri Mar 06, 2020 6:15 pm
AMS wrote:
Fri Mar 06, 2020 5:20 pm
The front page of today's Torygraph is talking about a tunnel from Portpatrick to Larne. Apparently this could be built within 10 years.
Tunnel under the million tons of mouldering bombs? That sounds fine.
Explosions go upwards, that's right isn't it?


Unless some of the bombs are upside-down! :shock:

Somebody should probably go down there and check, can I nominate ... absolutely anybody from the Cabinet.
I lolled.
Born at 356.32 ppm CO2 #ShowYourStripes

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Re: Boris Johnson is an idiot - irish bridge edition

Post by AMS » Fri Mar 06, 2020 7:17 pm

plebian wrote:
Fri Mar 06, 2020 6:46 pm
IIRC the tunnel ideas under the Irish sea are all more complex because of the depth and strata. Oh and length. The Chunnel is a doddle at 20miles, not too deep.

The only vaguely engineered option I've seen, ahem, floating about was a sunken tunnel of prefabbed, popped in a trench.
I vaguely remember something about the channel tunnel being carefully built through a specific stratigraphic layer for most of its route, for reasons involving stuff like water permeability. I imagine the geology is a bit more complex between Scotland/NI.

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Re: Boris Johnson is an idiot - irish bridge edition

Post by Woodchopper » Fri Mar 06, 2020 7:30 pm

plebian wrote:
Fri Mar 06, 2020 6:46 pm
IIRC the tunnel ideas under the Irish sea are all more complex because of the depth and strata. Oh and length. The Chunnel is a doddle at 20miles, not too deep.

The only vaguely engineered option I've seen, ahem, floating about was a sunken tunnel of prefabbed, popped in a trench.
That prefab tunnel would have to be very strong if it’s to withstand 300 meters of water above it.

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Re: Boris Johnson is an idiot - irish bridge edition

Post by plebian » Fri Mar 06, 2020 7:34 pm

It was, a pipe dream.
Pithy, well, a right helmet at least.

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Re: Boris Johnson is an idiot - irish bridge edition

Post by Martin Y » Fri Mar 06, 2020 8:29 pm

What if they avoid the bombs by digging in the opposite direction and keep going till they come right back around?

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Re: Boris Johnson is an idiot - irish bridge edition

Post by tenchboy » Fri Mar 06, 2020 8:49 pm

AMS wrote:
Fri Mar 06, 2020 7:17 pm
plebian wrote:
Fri Mar 06, 2020 6:46 pm
IIRC the tunnel ideas under the Irish sea are all more complex because of the depth and strata. Oh and length. The Chunnel is a doddle at 20miles, not too deep.

The only vaguely engineered option I've seen, ahem, floating about was a sunken tunnel of prefabbed, popped in a trench.
I vaguely remember something about the channel tunnel being carefully built through a specific stratigraphic layer for most of its route, for reasons involving stuff like water permeability. I imagine the geology is a bit more complex between Scotland/NI.
Without checking anything whatsoever, I'll take a chance and say that I too, vaguely remember that it was bored through the gault clay - which is the next very soft layer down below the lower chalk and glauconitic marl - which crops out at Folkstone and that is why it went from there rather than Dover.
The gault clay at Folkstone is notable for some of the most beautiful little fossil ammonites that can pick up anywhere in England: euhoplites and anahoplites, between an inch and an inch and a half in diameter, all covered in a pinky mother of pearl that just glistens in the mud slides after a shower of rain.

ETA: pics

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Re: Boris Johnson is an idiot - irish bridge edition

Post by rockdoctor » Fri Mar 06, 2020 10:46 pm

Not quite, Chunnel was dug through the Chalk Marl, which is a softer layer at the base of the chalk.
https://www.geolsoc.org.uk/GeositesChannelTunnel

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Re: Boris Johnson is an idiot - irish bridge edition

Post by tenchboy » Fri Mar 06, 2020 11:00 pm

rockdoctor wrote:
Fri Mar 06, 2020 10:46 pm
Not quite, Chunnel was dug through the Chalk Marl, which is a softer layer at the base of the chalk.
https://www.geolsoc.org.uk/GeositesChannelTunnel
Damn! So close; if only I'd a'checked first.
But nice little cut out and keep guide there; cheers RD.

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Re: Boris Johnson is an idiot - irish bridge edition

Post by dyqik » Fri Mar 06, 2020 11:39 pm

rockdoctor wrote:
Fri Mar 06, 2020 10:46 pm
Not quite, Chunnel was dug through the Chalk Marl, which is a softer layer at the base of the chalk.
https://www.geolsoc.org.uk/GeositesChannelTunnel
Seeing that URL, I'm wondering if there's a http://www.geolsoc.org.uk/GeoCities link

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Re: Boris Johnson is an idiot - irish bridge edition

Post by Gfamily » Sat Mar 07, 2020 12:47 am

dyqik wrote:
Fri Mar 06, 2020 11:39 pm
rockdoctor wrote:
Fri Mar 06, 2020 10:46 pm
Not quite, Chunnel was dug through the Chalk Marl, which is a softer layer at the base of the chalk.
https://www.geolsoc.org.uk/GeositesChannelTunnel
Seeing that URL, I'm wondering if there's a http://www.geolsoc.org.uk/GeoCities link
eh, apparently not.
My avatar was a scientific result that was later found to be 'mistaken' - I rarely claim to be 100% correct
ETA 5/8/20: I've been advised that the result was correct, it was the initial interpretation that needed to be withdrawn
Meta? I'd say so!

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Re: Boris Johnson is an idiot - irish bridge edition

Post by dyqik » Sat Mar 07, 2020 1:39 am

Gfamily wrote:
Sat Mar 07, 2020 12:47 am
dyqik wrote:
Fri Mar 06, 2020 11:39 pm
rockdoctor wrote:
Fri Mar 06, 2020 10:46 pm
Not quite, Chunnel was dug through the Chalk Marl, which is a softer layer at the base of the chalk.
https://www.geolsoc.org.uk/GeositesChannelTunnel
Seeing that URL, I'm wondering if there's a http://www.geolsoc.org.uk/GeoCities link
eh, apparently not.
WHY NOT, DAMMIT!

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Re: Boris Johnson is an idiot - irish bridge edition

Post by Woodchopper » Sat Mar 07, 2020 8:26 am

As a rough guide, the Boknafjord tunnel in Norway is under construction and will be up to 392 meters deep and 27.3 km long. Its claimed that it'll be the longest and deepest undersea road tunnel in the world.

Portpatrick to Larne would be circa 45km but shallower as the Beaufort Dyke is 200–300 meters deep.

The budget for the Boknafjord tunnel is circa £1.60 billion (which could of course increase) and construction is planned to take about 8-9 years from after parliamentary approval was granted (I assume that there was years of preliminary work before that). (Link in Norwegian)

IIRC the price estimates for a Portpatrick to Larne bridge were between £15-20 billion, and even after being constructed the bridge would have the complication of having to be closed during stormy weather. So a tunnel does look like the much cheaper and less-bonkers option as long as the geology isn't too much of a problem. Though IMHO there are better things to spend he money on.

Fun fact, the deep waters in both Boknafjord and the Beaufort Dyke were caused by the rock being carved out during the last ice age.

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