Vaccine Refusers

Covid-19 discussion, bring your own statistics
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lpm
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Re: Vaccine Refusers

Post by lpm » Mon Feb 15, 2021 7:28 pm

Vaccine passports:

- I insist they are blue, not having EU maroon
- UK will be in safest zone, better than the EU, so the pressure differential should be the other way for visitors to the UK
- won't happen until everyone has been offered 1st dose (likely July)
- all adult 2nd doses will be done end Aug/early Sept

So in theory will only discriminate against refusers, not "still waiting".

I don't see why private companies should be disallowed from discrimination. After all, on the other forum several people argued it was fine for private clubs to disallow jews, pregnant women and children.

But it's going to be fun when many more minorities than white people get turned away from nightclubs...
What ever happened to that Trump guy, you know, the one who was president for a bit?

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jdc
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Re: Vaccine Refusers

Post by jdc » Mon Feb 15, 2021 7:30 pm

Sydney Septic wrote:
Mon Feb 15, 2021 6:14 am
Also that she may actually be increasing her risk of dementia. eg Covid causes strokes, strokes cause vascular dementia. I'm not sure how valid this is?
Well ... https://www.nature.com/articles/d41586-020-03360-8 Delirium is very common on COVID wards. Researchers are testing whether these temporary bouts of confusion could bring on permanent cognitive decline.

https://www.statnews.com/2020/06/25/cov ... lications/ When Covid-19 hits the brain, it can cause strokes, psychosis and a dementia-like syndrome, new survey shows

I'm afraid I'm not sure this'll actually help though. If someone believes that isolating is good because it prevents covid and vaccines are bad because they prevent covid...

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Snowbonk
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Re: Vaccine Refusers

Post by headshot » Mon Feb 15, 2021 8:28 pm

I don't think he's really considered any of this much. My wife has quite severe asthma, but has just found out that she doesn't fulfil the criteria for "at risk" and so won't be in cohort six for the next rollout of the vaccine. Very frustrating given how careful she/we have been over the last year.

Sydney Septic
Ghastly Pink
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Re: Vaccine Refusers

Post by Sydney Septic » Mon Feb 15, 2021 9:28 pm

[/quote]

Well ... https://www.nature.com/articles/d41586-020-03360-8 Delirium is very common on COVID wards. Researchers are testing whether these temporary bouts of confusion could bring on permanent cognitive decline.

https://www.statnews.com/2020/06/25/cov ... lications/ When Covid-19 hits the brain, it can cause strokes, psychosis and a dementia-like syndrome, new survey shows

I'm afraid I'm not sure this'll actually help though. If someone believes that isolating is good because it prevents covid and vaccines are bad because they prevent covid...
[/quote]

Many thanks JDC.

You're quite right. She reached her decision through gut feeling. Evidence and reason aren't going to shift her. I suspect I'm arguing with her for my benefit rather than hers, but I will pass on your links above for her to ignore.

Cheers

S-S

Chris Preston
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Re: Vaccine Refusers

Post by Chris Preston » Tue Feb 16, 2021 8:53 am

Sydney Septic wrote:
Mon Feb 15, 2021 6:14 am
Hi All

Sadly, my 86 year old Mum is a vaccine refuser (in the UK).

Although she's not averse to conspiracy b.llsh.t, and has been known to go on the occasional anti-MMR rant, her reason this time has thrown me a little.

She doesn't want the vaccination because she doesn't want dementia. She essentially believes that anything that keeps her alive longer is leading her inexorably towards the sad and slow death she watched her elder sister endure.

At the same time, she continues to take all her meds and is following all isolating protocols religiously because 'Of course I don't want bl..dy Covid'.

I've pointed out that even at 86, the survival rate is around 85%, but with significant risks of long term harm which could hugely impact her quality of life without the swift release that she seems to be hoping for.
Also that she may actually be increasing her risk of dementia. eg Covid causes strokes, strokes cause vascular dementia. I'm not sure how valid this is?

I've also laboured on about the non-selfish reasons to have the jab, but to no effect.

I'd really appreciate any suggestions / facts / figures from anyone who understands this better than I (everyone?), though I suspect that evidence and logic won't be the answer here. But I feel I have to try.

Thanks in advance.

Cheers

S-S
Just providing information is not likely to help. Your best approach is to get someone she trusts to talk to her in person about how important it is for everyone that she gets the vaccine.
Here grows much rhubarb.

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Woodchopper
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Re: Vaccine Refusers

Post by Woodchopper » Thu Feb 18, 2021 6:41 pm

Summary in Nature

COVID vaccines and safety: what the research says
https://www.nature.com/articles/d41586-021-00290-x

May be useful though I guess many refusers won’t read it.

Sydney Septic
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Re: Vaccine Refusers

Post by Sydney Septic » Fri Feb 19, 2021 2:38 am

[/quote]

Just providing information is not likely to help. Your best approach is to get someone she trusts to talk to her in person about how important it is for everyone that she gets the vaccine.
[/quote]

Thanks Chris - I think you're right.

Unfortunately there is nothing she trusts as much as her intuition.

'My gut instinct tells me that not having the jab reduces my chances of dementia - your evidence is therefore inadmissible'.

I think that she would literally prefer to die than deal with the cognitive dissonance, and I've no idea how to help her.

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