Tier 4

Covid-19 discussion, bring your own statistics
Hunting Dog
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Re: Tier 4

Post by Hunting Dog » Sun Dec 20, 2020 7:38 pm

Trinucleus wrote:
Sun Dec 20, 2020 6:47 pm
Aside from Christmas, the only difference with Tier 4 seems to be non essential shops closing. Is that really going to make such a difference?
and gyms and indoor sports and "Residents should stay at home, unless they have a 'reasonable excuse' such as work or education" - or, I think, outdoor exercise on your own - which isn't in the T3 stuff, but is rather open to interpretation.

it would make more difference if they made a decision about whether schools in T4 are actually going to reopen. And also why the f' is indoor "Communal religious worship" still allowed?

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Re: Tier 4

Post by bagpuss » Sun Dec 20, 2020 10:35 pm

Trinucleus wrote:
Sun Dec 20, 2020 6:47 pm
Aside from Christmas, the only difference with Tier 4 seems to be non essential shops closing. Is that really going to make such a difference?
There are other differences too.

Now only allowed to meet up with one other person outside in public space, not "rule of 6" as applies in Tier 3, and if I'm reading the rules right, you can only do this for exercise, not for social reasons.

So outdoor sports now only permitted within single household or 1 individual meeting 1 individual from another household. Many outdoor attractions also therefore now closing.

Also "personal care" stuff like hairdressers, etc, also need to close.

I'm not sure which rules exactly have led to this, but lots of local outdoor events - Christmas light trails, etc - have closed because of Tier 4. Not sure if this is because of the general "stay at home" message, or because the no household mixing would cause problems, or if there's some other rule that requires it that I've missed.

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Tessa K
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Re: Tier 4

Post by Tessa K » Mon Dec 21, 2020 9:58 am

Welcome to Plague Island. It's like Love Island only without the sun, the bikinis or the prize money.

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Re: Tier 4

Post by Hunting Dog » Mon Dec 21, 2020 10:57 am

Tessa K wrote:
Mon Dec 21, 2020 9:58 am
Welcome to Plague Island. It's like Love Island only without the sun, the bikinis or the prize money.
+ you can only have the Love part within your existing household (if any), and there might not be any food

apart from that, it's going swimmingly

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Little waster
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Re: Tier 4

Post by Little waster » Mon Dec 21, 2020 11:05 am

Hunting Dog wrote:
Mon Dec 21, 2020 10:57 am
Tessa K wrote:
Mon Dec 21, 2020 9:58 am
Welcome to Plague Island. It's like Love Island only without the sun, the bikinis or the prize money.
+ you can only have the Love part within your existing household (if any),
IIRC the genuine advice was to avoid face-to-face snuggle-bumps in favour of some other more exotic variants and to wear a mask if possible.

This will not be a novel experience for some... ;)
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Re: Tier 4

Post by badger » Mon Dec 21, 2020 11:21 am

bagpuss wrote:
Sun Dec 20, 2020 10:35 pm

*snip*

So outdoor sports now only permitted within single household or 1 individual meeting 1 individual from another household. Many outdoor attractions also therefore now closing.
Organised outdoor sport still allowed for the young'uns, as long as following correct guidance.

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Re: Tier 4

Post by bagpuss » Mon Dec 21, 2020 11:32 am

badger wrote:
Mon Dec 21, 2020 11:21 am
bagpuss wrote:
Sun Dec 20, 2020 10:35 pm

*snip*

So outdoor sports now only permitted within single household or 1 individual meeting 1 individual from another household. Many outdoor attractions also therefore now closing.
Organised outdoor sport still allowed for the young'uns, as long as following correct guidance.
Good point, thanks for clarifying

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Gfamily
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Re: Tier 4

Post by Gfamily » Mon Dec 21, 2020 11:58 am

I'm not sure of our status, but GfDaughter broke her collarbone last month and MrsGf has been at her London address for 3 weeks to support her. I went down last week to bring them back north (Tier 2) for Christmas

We were going to be driving back to ours next week, but set off yesterday instead. One significant factor is that MrsGf had taken a month's worth of her medication with her, so needed to be home to be able to continue taking it.
We couldn't leave GfD on her own (because temporary disability assistance),
and couldn't remain at hers (because MrsGf's medication being 'at home')

So today we travelled out of a Tier 4 location to a Tier 2 location. I think we can justify it; but who knows? We'll keeping to our little bubble.
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Tessa K
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Re: Tier 4

Post by Tessa K » Mon Dec 21, 2020 12:53 pm

Sainsbury's was busy this morning. I did my normal Monday shop and then panic-bought a chorizo. Sorry.

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headshot
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Re: Tier 4

Post by headshot » Mon Dec 21, 2020 3:22 pm

Gfamily wrote:
Mon Dec 21, 2020 11:58 am
I'm not sure of our status, but GfDaughter broke her collarbone last month and MrsGf has been at her London address for 3 weeks to support her. I went down last week to bring them back north (Tier 2) for Christmas

We were going to be driving back to ours next week, but set off yesterday instead. One significant factor is that MrsGf had taken a month's worth of her medication with her, so needed to be home to be able to continue taking it.
We couldn't leave GfD on her own (because temporary disability assistance),
and couldn't remain at hers (because MrsGf's medication being 'at home')

So today we travelled out of a Tier 4 location to a Tier 2 location. I think we can justify it; but who knows? We'll keeping to our little bubble.
No-one will be checking, so it’s academic.

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shpalman
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Re: Tier 4

Post by shpalman » Mon Dec 21, 2020 7:02 pm

molto tricky

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Martin_B
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Re: Tier 4

Post by Martin_B » Tue Dec 22, 2020 12:26 am

"My interest is in the future, because I'm going to spend the rest of my life there"

Millennie Al
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Re: Tier 4

Post by Millennie Al » Tue Dec 22, 2020 1:20 am

headshot wrote:
Mon Dec 21, 2020 3:22 pm
Gfamily wrote:
Mon Dec 21, 2020 11:58 am
So today we travelled out of a Tier 4 location to a Tier 2 location. I think we can justify it; but who knows? We'll keeping to our little bubble.
No-one will be checking, so it’s academic.
The virus will be checking. It never sleeps.

But your precautions sound perfectly adequate. One of the problems we have had is people focusing on the rules, as if the virus cares about what special exceptions Boris has dreamed up today. If everyone kept to their bubbles we'd do much better.
Covid-19 - Don't catch it: don't spread it.

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Re: Tier 4

Post by JellyandJackson » Tue Dec 22, 2020 10:10 am

Hunting Dog wrote:
Sun Dec 20, 2020 7:38 pm
Trinucleus wrote:
Sun Dec 20, 2020 6:47 pm
Aside from Christmas, the only difference with Tier 4 seems to be non essential shops closing. Is that really going to make such a difference?
and gyms and indoor sports and "Residents should stay at home, unless they have a 'reasonable excuse' such as work or education" - or, I think, outdoor exercise on your own - which isn't in the T3 stuff, but is rather open to interpretation.

it would make more difference if they made a decision about whether schools in T4 are actually going to reopen. And also why the f' is indoor "Communal religious worship" still allowed?
Communal religious worship is still allowed because it’s a Christian country and all that b.llsh.t. (See also notes about cancelling Christmas). I don’t believe that, but that’s the flag BJ wants to wave, I reckon. Somehow this is important now, in a way that it wasn’t before Eid, when meeting together for religious celebrations was disallowed with a day’s notice. Our church, and lots of others locally, aren’t opening up for services. I think that’s absolutely the right decision.
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Tessa K
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Re: Tier 4

Post by Tessa K » Tue Dec 22, 2020 1:22 pm

No communal worship for druids this year though.
English Heritage is "using the Covid crisis as an excuse" not to allow people to celebrate the Winter Solstice at Stonehenge, a senior druid has said. King Arthur Pendragon said the ancient stone circle "should be open as other places of worship are". English Heritage maintains it cannot host the usual celebrations at the prehistoric monument on 21 December due to safety concerns. The sunrise at the stones will be live-streamed this year instead...

The event usually attracts crowds of up to 5,000 people, and English Heritage said it took the decision in the interest of public health following advice from Wiltshire Council and Wiltshire Police. However Mr Pendragon argued: "You can't get more Covid secure than you can in the middle of the field."
He said he will still observe the sunrise "as close as legally possible" to the stones from adjacent land.
https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england-w ... e-55329808

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shpalman
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Re: Tier 4

Post by shpalman » Wed Dec 23, 2020 3:26 pm

Millions of the people who we were afraid to put into tier 3 now have to go into tier 4

Unimportant people in the north who were already in tier 3 are apparently still in it, don't know, haven't checked, can't be that many of them.

"There are nearly 1.4 million people living in Birmingham, according to the Office for National Statistics" - gosh that's a lot I keep forgetting that there are other cities apart from London.
molto tricky

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Re: Tier 4

Post by shpalman » Wed Dec 23, 2020 3:32 pm

Ahead of the announcement, a briefing for MPs with the health minister Nadhim Zahawi descended into chaos when some were unable to join because of a 100-person limit on the Zoom call.
molto tricky

Trinucleus
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Re: Tier 4

Post by Trinucleus » Wed Dec 23, 2020 3:40 pm

shpalman wrote:
Wed Dec 23, 2020 3:26 pm
Millions of the people who we were afraid to put into tier 3 now have to go into tier 4

Unimportant people in the north who were already in tier 3 are apparently still in it, don't know, haven't checked, can't be that many of them.

"There are nearly 1.4 million people living in Birmingham, according to the Office for National Statistics" - gosh that's a lot I keep forgetting that there are other cities apart from London.
They said that the new variant was everywhere. Is it not spreading as much up here in Yorkshire? Our cases are going up, but only slowly at present.

Soft Southern virus

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shpalman
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Re: Tier 4

Post by shpalman » Wed Dec 23, 2020 3:45 pm

Trinucleus wrote:
Wed Dec 23, 2020 3:40 pm
shpalman wrote:
Wed Dec 23, 2020 3:26 pm
Millions of the people who we were afraid to put into tier 3 now have to go into tier 4

Unimportant people in the north who were already in tier 3 are apparently still in it, don't know, haven't checked, can't be that many of them.

"There are nearly 1.4 million people living in Birmingham, according to the Office for National Statistics" - gosh that's a lot I keep forgetting that there are other cities apart from London.
They said that the new variant was everywhere. Is it not spreading as much up here in Yorkshire? Our cases are going up, but only slowly at present.

Soft Southern virus
Case rates are flat in East Lindsey, which is the bit of Lincolnshire where Woodhall Spa is.
molto tricky

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shpalman
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Re: Tier 4

Post by shpalman » Wed Dec 23, 2020 3:48 pm

"In response to a question about whether should be a full national lockdown, Hancock said the new variant is highly concentrated and the stay at home rule aims to quell it."

Yes it's highly concentrated in people who are infected with it.
molto tricky

Hunting Dog
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Re: Tier 4

Post by Hunting Dog » Wed Dec 23, 2020 3:52 pm

Ah well, the BBC coronovirus map has finally introduced a new colour for our little bit of the soft south as we seem to be too far off the end of the old scale :(

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jimbob
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Re: Tier 4

Post by jimbob » Sat Dec 26, 2020 10:48 am

Gfamily wrote:
Mon Dec 21, 2020 11:58 am
I'm not sure of our status, but GfDaughter broke her collarbone last month and MrsGf has been at her London address for 3 weeks to support her. I went down last week to bring them back north (Tier 2) for Christmas

We were going to be driving back to ours next week, but set off yesterday instead. One significant factor is that MrsGf had taken a month's worth of her medication with her, so needed to be home to be able to continue taking it.
We couldn't leave GfD on her own (because temporary disability assistance),
and couldn't remain at hers (because MrsGf's medication being 'at home')

So today we travelled out of a Tier 4 location to a Tier 2 location. I think we can justify it; but who knows? We'll keeping to our little bubble.
That would be a valid exemption.
Have you considered stupidity as an explanation

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Bird on a Fire
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Re: Tier 4

Post by Bird on a Fire » Sat Dec 26, 2020 1:34 pm

Winchester high street is still rammed with c.nts, none of them with masks on.

Maybe they haven't seen the news?
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shpalman
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Tier 5

Post by shpalman » Tue Dec 29, 2020 1:02 pm

We're gonna need a bigger tier

or, alternatively, WHAT THE f.ck WAS STILL ALLOWED IN TIER 4 WHICH THERE IS LEFT TO FORBID

With a side order of "forcing the schools to stay open before Christmas was entirely correct children don't get covid but now forcing them to close is entirely correct something something children can get the new variant"
molto tricky

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Woodchopper
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Re: Tier 4

Post by Woodchopper » Tue Dec 29, 2020 1:19 pm

I just had a look at the positive testing numbers in Kent. Its looking bad, and will presumably have got a lot worse by now.

First figure is per cent positive PCR tests seven day average on 23 December, and the second figure is the seven day average at 1 September:

Medway: 23%, 1.5%
Gravesham, 20.9%, 1.9%
Swale, 15.9%, 1.3%
Dartford, 20.1%, 2.2%
Canterbury, 13.6%, 1.5%
Thanet, 11%, 0.9%
Folkestone and Hythe, 13.1%, 0.6%
Ashford, 17%, 0.5%
Tunbridge Wells, 10%, 1.2%
Maidstone, 14.5%, 0.7%
Tonbridge and Malling, 13.2%, 1.2%
Sevenoaks, 13.5%, 1.5%

Numbers from here: https://coronavirus.data.gov.uk/details/testing

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