Developing the Covid-19 vaccine

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Millennie Al
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Re: Developing the Covid-19 vaccine

Post by Millennie Al » Fri Dec 31, 2021 2:26 am

Woodchopper wrote:
Thu Dec 30, 2021 11:38 pm
tl;dr effect of the third booster on being infectious wanes after a few months, at the same rate as the second dose.

IMHO we may be looking at biannual vaccinations indefinitely.
That would be ethically dubious. Such vaccinations would then be almost entirely administered to patients for the benefit of others. We don't do that. We currently administer vaccines either solely for the benefit of the patient (e.g. rabies) or for the benefit of patients with the desireable side-effect of reducing transmission and so benefiting others (e.g. measles). Since the Covid vaccines seem to continue to protect the vaccinated against severe illness even after they have lost their power to protect against catching the disease, repeated vaccination would be of little benefit to the vaccinated.
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Woodchopper
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Re: Developing the Covid-19 vaccine

Post by Woodchopper » Fri Dec 31, 2021 5:20 am

Millennie Al wrote:
Fri Dec 31, 2021 2:26 am
Woodchopper wrote:
Thu Dec 30, 2021 11:38 pm
tl;dr effect of the third booster on being infectious wanes after a few months, at the same rate as the second dose.

IMHO we may be looking at biannual vaccinations indefinitely.
That would be ethically dubious. Such vaccinations would then be almost entirely administered to patients for the benefit of others. We don't do that. We currently administer vaccines either solely for the benefit of the patient (e.g. rabies) or for the benefit of patients with the desireable side-effect of reducing transmission and so benefiting others (e.g. measles). Since the Covid vaccines seem to continue to protect the vaccinated against severe illness even after they have lost their power to protect against catching the disease, repeated vaccination would be of little benefit to the vaccinated.
It would be a problem to compel people who were very unlikely to be seriously ill to be vaccinated. I don’t see a problem if it’s voluntary. There is a difficult moral grey area between the two.

Millennie Al
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Re: Developing the Covid-19 vaccine

Post by Millennie Al » Sun Jan 02, 2022 12:45 am

Woodchopper wrote:
Fri Dec 31, 2021 5:20 am
It would be a problem to compel people who were very unlikely to be seriously ill to be vaccinated. I don’t see a problem if it’s voluntary. There is a difficult moral grey area between the two.
There's also an issue if it's voluntary but deceit over the benefit is used to encourage uptake.
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bob sterman
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Re: Developing the Covid-19 vaccine

Post by bob sterman » Sun Jan 02, 2022 7:30 am

Millennie Al wrote:
Fri Dec 31, 2021 2:26 am
Woodchopper wrote:
Thu Dec 30, 2021 11:38 pm
tl;dr effect of the third booster on being infectious wanes after a few months, at the same rate as the second dose.

IMHO we may be looking at biannual vaccinations indefinitely.
That would be ethically dubious. Such vaccinations would then be almost entirely administered to patients for the benefit of others. We don't do that. We currently administer vaccines either solely for the benefit of the patient (e.g. rabies) or for the benefit of patients with the desireable side-effect of reducing transmission and so benefiting others (e.g. measles). Since the Covid vaccines seem to continue to protect the vaccinated against severe illness even after they have lost their power to protect against catching the disease, repeated vaccination would be of little benefit to the vaccinated.
We do administer some vaccines where the main benefit is prevention of severe disease in others (where they only provide small benefits to the person vaccinated). E.g.

A major benefit of childhood flu vaccinations for school age kids is that they prevent transmission and severe disease in babies and the elderly.

HPV vaccines for teenage boys - main benefit is that it prevents transmission and hence cervical cancer in women. The benefits to boys are small.

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Bird on a Fire
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Re: Developing the Covid-19 vaccine

Post by Bird on a Fire » Mon Jan 03, 2022 11:00 am

The rubella component of MMR is also mainly to protect pregnant people IIRC.
You can shove your climate crisis up your arse!

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Herainestold
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Re: Developing the Covid-19 vaccine

Post by Herainestold » Sun Jan 09, 2022 4:13 pm

A new protein subunit vaccine is approved and being manufactured in India. Is this similar to the Novavax vaccine?
A vaccine authorized in December for use in India may help solve one of the most vexing problems in global public health: How to supply lower-income countries with a COVID-19 vaccine that is safe, effective and affordable.

The vaccine is called CORBEVAX. It uses old but proven vaccine technology and can be manufactured far more easily than most, if not all, of the COVID-19 vaccines in use today.
"And it's cheap, a dollar, dollar fifty a dose," Hotez says. "You're not going to get less expensive than that."

Clinical trials showed they were right to be confident CORBEVAX would work. An unpublished study conducted in India involving 3,000 volunteers found the vaccine to be 90% effective in preventing disease cause by the original COVID-19 virus strain and 80% against the delta variant. It's still being tested against omicron.

But CORBEVAX is already entering the real world. Last month, the vaccine received emergency use authorization from regulators in India. An Indian vaccine manufacturer called Biological E Ltd is now making the vaccine. The company says it is producing 100 million doses per month and has already sold 300 million doses to the Indian government.

"The real beauty of the CORBEVAX vaccine that Drs. Hotez and Bottazzi created is that intellectual property of this vaccine will be available to everybody," Keith Martin says. "So you can get manufacturers in Senegal, and South Africa and Latin America to be able to produce this particular vaccine."
I doubt we will see this here, but a cheap easily manufactured vaccine will be good for global vaccine equity.

https://www.npr.org/sections/goatsandso ... ket-newtab
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Millennie Al
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Re: Developing the Covid-19 vaccine

Post by Millennie Al » Mon Jan 10, 2022 1:37 am

Herainestold wrote:
Sun Jan 09, 2022 4:13 pm
I doubt we will see this here, but a cheap easily manufactured vaccine will be good for global vaccine equity.
That doesn't seem very likely as there is already sufficient supply. The limits are elsewhere.

Story from February: https://economictimes.indiatimes.com/in ... 947580.cms
The South African government has denied that it has asked Serum Institute of India (SII) to take back the 1 million doses of Covid-19 vaccines that the company had sent in early February. The government said that it plans to share the vaccines with other african countries. ... it decided to halt the use of the AstraZeneca-Oxford vaccine, as a trial found that the jab provided only ‘minimal protection’ against mild and moderate cases of Covid-19 caused by the new variant that accounts for 90% of infections in that country. South Africa has paid $1million to procure the AZ/Oxford vaccines that SII is manufacturing.
So that's down to $1 per dose already.

And from April South Africa's Health Minister Zweli Mkhize said: https://economictimes.indiatimes.com/in ... 982170.cms
"We have now secured 51 million doses of vaccines with the agreements that have been signed - 31 million from Johnson and Johnson, which is a one-dose vaccine; and 20 million from Pfizer
, which is a two-dose vaccine.

"This means that we can now move forward with confidence as we finalise our plans for our mass rollout campaign, which is due to officially begin at the end of phase one on May 17," he said.
So South Africa is able to buy the vaccines they want on the open market at the current prices.

And from December: https://timesofindia.indiatimes.com/bus ... 156036.cms
Serum Institute of India (SII), the world’s largest vaccine manufacturer by volume, on Tuesday said it is slashing production of Covishield by at least 50% from next week as the company has no further orders from the Centre.
...
Serum has 500 million doses of Covishield—half of that is finished product and half of that is bulk, which can be filled and finished in a matter of two months, and it has a shelf life of nine months—and it is available on priority to the Indian government.
Pointing out that the export of Covishield is also slow currently, he said the export orders would pick up in the next quarter. “Over the eight months when we could not export, other countries managed supplies from donations from the US and elsewhere and we have lost a lot of share,” he said, adding that he is now going to try to claw the demand back in the first quarter of next year.
So it's now just a commercial operation with different suppliers competing for market share. Maybe the poorest countries need money to be donated to pay for doses, or help to adminster them, but the global supply is enough for everyone already.
Covid-19 - Don't catch it: don't spread it.

Herainestold
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Re: Developing the Covid-19 vaccine

Post by Herainestold » Fri Jan 21, 2022 10:49 pm

Nordic countries are limiting the administration of Moderna vax.
COPENHAGEN, Denmark (AP) — Finland has joined other Nordic countries in suspending or discouraging the use of Moderna’s COVID-19 vaccine in certain age groups because of an increased risk of heart inflammation, a rare side effect associated with the shot.

The Finnish Institute for Health and Welfare said Thursday that authorities won’t give the shot to males under age 30. They will be offered the Pfizer/BioNTech vaccine instead. The government agency said it found that young men and boys were at a slightly higher risk of developing myocarditis.
https://www.wjhl.com/news/international ... rna-shots/
Dark days lie ahead.

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