Corona-woo

Covid-19 discussion, bring your own statistics
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shpalman
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Re: Corona-woo

Post by shpalman » Thu May 07, 2020 7:54 pm

I'm putting this here because I don't really think there's anything in it, but suspicions that covid was circulating at the 7th CISM Military World Games in Wuhan in October 2019 were on the news here earlier, including the allegation that Americans brought it to Wuhan.
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Re: Corona-woo

Post by EACLucifer » Fri May 08, 2020 4:23 am

It's Global News, a paper less honest than the Sun that exists to promote a fascist regime, and is widely recognised as a source of disinformation in general, and especially around coronavirus.

China is desperate for people to believe conspiracy theories, hence the amount is pushing, and hence also their threats against Australia for wanting an open enquiry to how the pandemic got going.

An article on the conduct of the Chinese regime from Global Times should be treated much the same as an article on the conduct of the Nazi regime from Der Sturmer.

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Re: Corona-woo

Post by shpalman » Fri May 08, 2020 6:26 am

EACLucifer wrote:
Fri May 08, 2020 4:23 am
It's Global News, a paper less honest than the Sun that exists to promote a fascist regime, and is widely recognised as a source of disinformation in general, and especially around coronavirus.

China is desperate for people to believe conspiracy theories, hence the amount is pushing, and hence also their threats against Australia for wanting an open enquiry to how the pandemic got going.

An article on the conduct of the Chinese regime from Global Times should be treated much the same as an article on the conduct of the Nazi regime from Der Sturmer.
Globaltimes is in this case the one saying that it wasn't covid, it was malaria. So we should automatically believe it was already covid?

Because I think it's the accusations that SARS-CoV-2 dates back to October, if not September, to be the unsubstantiated ones, but it would on the face of it only put the jump from animals to humans a few months earlier than what is currently accepted.

The idea that it was Americans who brought the virus to Wuhan is just nonsense, a counter-attack to the US complaining they didn't get enough warning.
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Re: Corona-woo

Post by Herainestold » Fri May 08, 2020 1:58 pm

shpalman wrote:
Fri May 08, 2020 6:26 am

Globaltimes is in this case the one saying that it wasn't covid, it was malaria. So we should automatically believe it was already covid?

Because I think it's the accusations that SARS-CoV-2 dates back to October, if not September, to be the unsubstantiated ones, but it would on the face of it only put the jump from animals to humans a few months earlier than what is currently accepted.

The idea that it was Americans who brought the virus to Wuhan is just nonsense, a counter-attack to the US complaining they didn't get enough warning.
The known facts keep changing quickly in such a fluid situtation. I thought the date of the first emergence in humans could be tracked by tracing the mutations of the virus. I also read that patient zero had no connection to the Wuhan market, which suggests that the market was a locus for transmission rather than the source.The origin in America idea, is that it only mutated to be easily transmissable between humans once it reached China. I don't know if that is reasonable or not.

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Re: Corona-woo

Post by JQH » Fri May 08, 2020 5:49 pm

Herainestold wrote:
Fri May 08, 2020 1:58 pm
The origin in America idea, is that it only mutated to be easily transmissable between humans once it reached China. I don't know if that is reasonable or not.
So you are saying that hypothetical American agents brought a virus into China that was NOT easily tranmissable between humans. For what purpose? Clearly not biological warfare.
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Re: Corona-woo

Post by Herainestold » Fri May 08, 2020 6:51 pm

JQH wrote:
Fri May 08, 2020 5:49 pm
Herainestold wrote:
Fri May 08, 2020 1:58 pm
The origin in America idea, is that it only mutated to be easily transmissable between humans once it reached China. I don't know if that is reasonable or not.
So you are saying that hypothetical American agents brought a virus into China that was NOT easily tranmissable between humans. For what purpose? Clearly not biological warfare.
By accident. There have been biosecurity breaches at some of America's big biowarfare labs. It is well documented. The virus appears not to have been modified by humans, it was probably just collected as raw material. Accidentally released as a security breach it travelled with some Americans to the military games in Wuhan. It circulated weakly for some time, then mutated to a form more highly transmissable between people.

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Re: Corona-woo

Post by shpalman » Fri May 08, 2020 7:03 pm

That's only slightly weirder than the idea that it's a natural virus which was being studied in the lab near Wuhan but escaped and was somehow much more dangerous despite not having been modified from the wild type.
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Re: Corona-woo

Post by Herainestold » Fri May 08, 2020 7:07 pm

More corona woo. Vice examines Plandemic and Judy Mikovits.

https://www.vice.com/en_us/article/9359 ... jhoOaxRykk

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Re: Corona-woo

Post by Herainestold » Fri May 08, 2020 7:11 pm

shpalman wrote:
Fri May 08, 2020 7:03 pm
That's only slightly weirder than the idea that it's a natural virus which was being studied in the lab near Wuhan but escaped and was somehow much more dangerous despite not having been modified from the wild type.
I think the point is that is was a wild dangerous form of the virus, that had never come into contact with people. Collected from a remote cave and taken to a populous city to be studied, it was accidentally released in the midst of a large human population.The rest is history.

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Re: Corona-woo

Post by shpalman » Fri May 08, 2020 7:30 pm

Ok this one is in Italian.

https://www.lastampa.it/sport/2020/05/0 ... 1.38815524

A member of the Italian fencing team basically saying they all (6 of them) got ill with something, and so did lots of others.

He said he had fever and a cough for three weeks which didn't respond to antibiotics.

Doesn't necessarily mean it was SARS-CoV-2 in particular though.
Last edited by shpalman on Fri May 08, 2020 7:36 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: Corona-woo

Post by Little waster » Fri May 08, 2020 7:34 pm

Herainestold wrote:
Fri May 08, 2020 7:07 pm
More corona woo. Vice examines Plandemic and Judy Mikovits.

https://www.vice.com/en_us/article/9359 ... jhoOaxRykk
[Puts on his Obiwan Kenobi voice]
“Judy Mikovits, now there’s a name I’ve not heard in a long, long time. A long time.
[/end]
Shamelessly recycling old jokes since 1952.

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Re: Corona-woo

Post by Herainestold » Fri May 08, 2020 7:38 pm

shpalman wrote:
Fri May 08, 2020 7:30 pm
Ok this one is in Italian.

https://www.lastampa.it/sport/2020/05/0 ... 1.38815524

A member of the Italian fencing team basically saying they all (6 of them) got ill with something, and so did lots of others.

He said he had fever and a cough for three weeks which didn't respond to antibiotics.

Doesn't necessarily mean it was SARS-CoV-2 in particular though.
No, without testing it doesn't mean much. It is suggestive, tho'

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Re: Corona-woo

Post by tenchboy » Fri May 08, 2020 8:00 pm

Herainestold wrote:
Fri May 08, 2020 7:38 pm
shpalman wrote:
Fri May 08, 2020 7:30 pm
Ok this one is in Italian.

https://www.lastampa.it/sport/2020/05/0 ... 1.38815524

A member of the Italian fencing team basically saying they all (6 of them) got ill with something, and so did lots of others.

He said he had fever and a cough for three weeks which didn't respond to antibiotics.

Doesn't necessarily mean it was SARS-CoV-2 in particular though.
No, without testing it doesn't mean much. It is suggestive, tho'
More likely it's the preservative/ inorganic anti-fungals used on the fence-posts & gravel boards, I've had similar m'self.

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Re: Corona-woo

Post by EACLucifer » Sat May 09, 2020 12:03 pm

Herainestold wrote:
Fri May 08, 2020 6:51 pm
JQH wrote:
Fri May 08, 2020 5:49 pm
Herainestold wrote:
Fri May 08, 2020 1:58 pm
The origin in America idea, is that it only mutated to be easily transmissable between humans once it reached China. I don't know if that is reasonable or not.
So you are saying that hypothetical American agents brought a virus into China that was NOT easily tranmissable between humans. For what purpose? Clearly not biological warfare.
By accident. There have been biosecurity breaches at some of America's big biowarfare labs. It is well documented. The virus appears not to have been modified by humans, it was probably just collected as raw material. Accidentally released as a security breach it travelled with some Americans to the military games in Wuhan. It circulated weakly for some time, then mutated to a form more highly transmissable between people.
This is just a piece of absolute b.llsh.t designed to spread confusion as to the origin. China obviously know the overwhelming likelihood of how it happened, as they threatened Australia for calling for a neutral inquiry into it.

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Re: Corona-woo

Post by Andysnat » Sat May 09, 2020 4:11 pm


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Re: Corona-woo

Post by JQH » Sat May 09, 2020 10:42 pm

Herainestold wrote:
Fri May 08, 2020 6:51 pm
JQH wrote:
Fri May 08, 2020 5:49 pm
Herainestold wrote:
Fri May 08, 2020 1:58 pm
The origin in America idea, is that it only mutated to be easily transmissable between humans once it reached China. I don't know if that is reasonable or not.
So you are saying that hypothetical American agents brought a virus into China that was NOT easily tranmissable between humans. For what purpose? Clearly not biological warfare.
By accident. There have been biosecurity breaches at some of America's big biowarfare labs. It is well documented. The virus appears not to have been modified by humans, it was probably just collected as raw material. Accidentally released as a security breach it travelled with some Americans to the military games in Wuhan. It circulated weakly for some time, then mutated to a form more highly transmissable between people.
In other words all you have is supposition, not a single shred of evidence.
And remember that if you botch the exit, the carnival of reaction may be coming to a town near you.

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Re: Corona-woo

Post by Herainestold » Sun May 10, 2020 10:45 pm

JQH wrote:
Sat May 09, 2020 10:42 pm

In other words all you have is supposition, not a single shred of evidence.
Yes.

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Re: Corona-woo

Post by Martin_B » Mon May 11, 2020 12:05 am

Herainestold wrote:
Sun May 10, 2020 10:45 pm
JQH wrote:
Sat May 09, 2020 10:42 pm

In other words all you have is supposition, not a single shred of evidence.
Yes.
To be fair to Herainestold, this doesn't make him (her?) different from ~80% of people on the internet
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Re: Corona-woo

Post by Herainestold » Mon May 11, 2020 7:17 pm

There is no real evidence that it started from the Wuhan wet market. It is a bat virus and bats were never sold at that market.
The study Holmes worked on suggested that the scenario in which a human at the Wuhan market interacted with an animal that carried the virus was only one potential version of the Covid-19 origin story. Another was the possibility that a descendent of the virus jumped into humans and then adapted as it was passed from human to human.
Analysis of the first 41 Covid-19 patients in medical journal the Lancet found that 27 of them had direct exposure to the Wuhan market. But the same analysis found that the first known case of the illness did not.
Previous viruses originated in wet markets, that seems to have prejudiced people in favour of the market origin hypothesis. The market was definitely a locus for infection, but did it originate there? Probably not.

https://www.theguardian.com/world/2020/ ... mal-market

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Re: Corona-woo

Post by EACLucifer » Tue May 12, 2020 5:53 pm

Martin_B wrote:
Mon May 11, 2020 12:05 am
Herainestold wrote:
Sun May 10, 2020 10:45 pm
JQH wrote:
Sat May 09, 2020 10:42 pm

In other words all you have is supposition, not a single shred of evidence.
Yes.
To be fair to Herainestold, this doesn't make him (her?) different from ~80% of people on the internet
But are 80% of the internet just regurgitating the propaganda of a fascist regime?

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Re: Corona-woo

Post by Martin_B » Wed May 13, 2020 2:16 am

EACLucifer wrote:
Tue May 12, 2020 5:53 pm
Martin_B wrote:
Mon May 11, 2020 12:05 am
Herainestold wrote:
Sun May 10, 2020 10:45 pm


Yes.
To be fair to Herainestold, this doesn't make him (her?) different from ~80% of people on the internet
But are 80% of the internet just regurgitating the propaganda of a fascist regime?
It does feel that way at times
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Re: Corona-woo

Post by Squeak » Wed May 13, 2020 10:48 am

A small partial win against Genesis II in Australia, though they're still selling their "sacrament" here.

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Re: Corona-woo

Post by JQH » Wed May 13, 2020 11:41 am

A step in the right direction, at least.
And remember that if you botch the exit, the carnival of reaction may be coming to a town near you.

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Re: Corona-woo

Post by shpalman » Mon May 18, 2020 5:09 pm

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Re: Corona-woo

Post by FlammableFlower » Wed Jul 08, 2020 8:58 pm

Father and Sons Charged in Miami Federal Court with Selling Toxic Bleach as Fake “Miracle” Cure for Covid-19 and Violating Court Orders
Defendants Allegedly Attempted to Avoid Government Regulation by Selling Products Through a Company They Deceptively Named Genesis II Church

Miami, Fl. – Federal prosecutors in Miami have charged four Florida residents who allegedly marketed “Miracle Mineral Solution,” a toxic bleach, as a cure for COVID-19, with conspiracy to defraud the United States, conspiracy to violate the Federal Food, Drug and Cosmetic Act, and criminal contempt.

US gov link

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