Shame there wasn't space in that article to describe what he would replace it with and how he would get the relevant parties to sign up to his proposal.shpalman wrote: ↑Thu Jul 01, 2021 11:14 amNew DUP leader targets end to Northern Ireland protocol because of course he does.
Brexit Consequences
Re: Brexit Consequences
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Re: Brexit Consequences
https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/business-57690505
Nobody likes sweets in the UK do they. Cos if you do I hope you didn't vote for brexit. Haribo struggling to ship to the UK. Not solely brexit, covid played it's part, but many drivers have left.
Nobody likes sweets in the UK do they. Cos if you do I hope you didn't vote for brexit. Haribo struggling to ship to the UK. Not solely brexit, covid played it's part, but many drivers have left.
I'm not afraid of catching Covid, I'm afraid of catching idiot.
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Re: Brexit Consequences
UK school skiing trips to EU could be wiped out by Brexit visa rules
Not all school skiing trips have been hit though. Hugues Raulet, who runs Halsbury Travel in Nottingham, said the only issue he is anticipating is delays at the border.
This is because his company employs local staff who do not need work visas.
having that swing is a necessary but not sufficient condition for it meaning a thing
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Re: Brexit Consequences
[Sorry, just catching up]Sciolus wrote: ↑Thu Jul 01, 2021 1:07 pmShame there wasn't space in that article to describe what he would replace it with and how he would get the relevant parties to sign up to his proposal.shpalman wrote: ↑Thu Jul 01, 2021 11:14 amNew DUP leader targets end to Northern Ireland protocol because of course he does.
It's the DUP. For them, the replacement as such is easy - bin the Good Friday Agreement. They never wanted it from the start and campaigned hard against it.
If you bring your kids up to think for themselves, you can't complain when they do.
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Re: Brexit Consequences
So as a result of Brexit, British kids are going to be more likely to have to interact with smelly foreigners?shpalman wrote: ↑Sat Jul 03, 2021 6:21 amUK school skiing trips to EU could be wiped out by Brexit visa rules
Not all school skiing trips have been hit though. Hugues Raulet, who runs Halsbury Travel in Nottingham, said the only issue he is anticipating is delays at the border.
This is because his company employs local staff who do not need work visas.
I wouldn't have guessed that UK ski trips would depend on important staff from the UK for a week at a time anyway - seems overly complicated and inefficient, though maybe xenophobia is extremely lucrative.
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Re: Brexit Consequences
In practice I suspect that there may be many opportunities for dual nationals or for EU nationals based in the UK. Schools that plan on doing trips to the EU will be looking to hire teachers who have an EU passport.Bird on a Fire wrote: ↑Sun Jul 04, 2021 10:09 amSo as a result of Brexit, British kids are going to be more likely to have to interact with smelly foreigners?shpalman wrote: ↑Sat Jul 03, 2021 6:21 amUK school skiing trips to EU could be wiped out by Brexit visa rules
Not all school skiing trips have been hit though. Hugues Raulet, who runs Halsbury Travel in Nottingham, said the only issue he is anticipating is delays at the border.
This is because his company employs local staff who do not need work visas.
I wouldn't have guessed that UK ski trips would depend on important staff from the UK for a week at a time anyway - seems overly complicated and inefficient, though maybe xenophobia is extremely lucrative.
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Re: Brexit Consequences
It's also possible that some of the UK "staff", maybe not the instructors themselves, are on a bit of a semi-paid holiday doing this sort of thing.Bird on a Fire wrote: ↑Sun Jul 04, 2021 10:09 amSo as a result of Brexit, British kids are going to be more likely to have to interact with smelly foreigners?shpalman wrote: ↑Sat Jul 03, 2021 6:21 amUK school skiing trips to EU could be wiped out by Brexit visa rules
Not all school skiing trips have been hit though. Hugues Raulet, who runs Halsbury Travel in Nottingham, said the only issue he is anticipating is delays at the border.
This is because his company employs local staff who do not need work visas.
I wouldn't have guessed that UK ski trips would depend on important staff from the UK for a week at a time anyway - seems overly complicated and inefficient, though maybe xenophobia is extremely lucrative.
But nevermind, they'll have to get taught to ski by people who actually live in the Alps and have skied literally every weekend (including the summer - there are glaciers at >3000 m for that) since they were about 4 years old plus every holiday, I know it won't be as good as some braying British public school trustfunder but still.
Also, https://www.bbc.com/news/world-europe-54523014 and https://www.bbc.com/news/world-europe-55465079
having that swing is a necessary but not sufficient condition for it meaning a thing
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Re: Brexit Consequences
The ski instructors should normally be locals. I doubt that many UK teachers are qualified. The issue for work permits will be who supervises the kids as the teachers have been doing that as part of their job.shpalman wrote: ↑Sun Jul 04, 2021 10:42 amIt's also possible that some of the UK "staff", maybe not the instructors themselves, are on a bit of a semi-paid holiday doing this sort of thing.Bird on a Fire wrote: ↑Sun Jul 04, 2021 10:09 amSo as a result of Brexit, British kids are going to be more likely to have to interact with smelly foreigners?shpalman wrote: ↑Sat Jul 03, 2021 6:21 amUK school skiing trips to EU could be wiped out by Brexit visa rules
I wouldn't have guessed that UK ski trips would depend on important staff from the UK for a week at a time anyway - seems overly complicated and inefficient, though maybe xenophobia is extremely lucrative.
But nevermind, they'll have to get taught to ski by people who actually live in the Alps and have skied literally every weekend (including the summer - there are glaciers at >3000 m for that) since they were about 4 years old plus every holiday, I know it won't be as good as some braying British public school trustfunder but still.
Also, https://www.bbc.com/news/world-europe-54523014 and https://www.bbc.com/news/world-europe-55465079
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Re: Brexit Consequences
I think it's not the school teachers affected, but the practice of importing British ski instructors for a few weeks at a time. Would you normally need a work permit to lead a school trip?Woodchopper wrote: ↑Sun Jul 04, 2021 10:36 amIn practice I suspect that there may be many opportunities for dual nationals or for EU nationals based in the UK. Schools that plan on doing trips to the EU will be looking to hire teachers who have an EU passport.Bird on a Fire wrote: ↑Sun Jul 04, 2021 10:09 amSo as a result of Brexit, British kids are going to be more likely to have to interact with smelly foreigners?shpalman wrote: ↑Sat Jul 03, 2021 6:21 amUK school skiing trips to EU could be wiped out by Brexit visa rules
I wouldn't have guessed that UK ski trips would depend on important staff from the UK for a week at a time anyway - seems overly complicated and inefficient, though maybe xenophobia is extremely lucrative.
As shpalman said, the poor dears are probably going to be forced into contact with local cultures instead. I thought Brexit was meant to prevent that sort of thing, but it's their own fault for wanting to go to foreign parts in the first place.
Or perhaps the government will come up with a plan to drain remaining peat uplands and cover them in artificial piste.
We have the right to a clean, healthy, sustainable environment.
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Re: Brexit Consequences
Still jolly unfair of the EU though. It's not like there's any problem for EU citizens getting seasonal work permits in the UK.
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Re: Brexit Consequences
UK-EU relations deteriorate again after ‘strange’ David Frost remarks
David Frost and Brandon Lewis: We must find a new balance in how NI protocol is operated
What remarks? These remarks:... relations between Brussels and London deteriorated again after remarks by the Brexit minister David Frost in the past 24 hours.
David Frost and Brandon Lewis: We must find a new balance in how NI protocol is operated
To simply say it must be implemented in full does not deal with the reality that now exists
having that swing is a necessary but not sufficient condition for it meaning a thing
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Re: Brexit Consequences
It’s good to know that Frost doesn’t have his head in the sand and to be fair he raises a number of salient points. The idea that there needs to be a hard border somewhere or the union needs to break up, because of rules, does beg the question that perhaps the rules need looking at.shpalman wrote: ↑Sun Jul 04, 2021 6:08 pmUK-EU relations deteriorate again after ‘strange’ David Frost remarks
What remarks? These remarks:... relations between Brussels and London deteriorated again after remarks by the Brexit minister David Frost in the past 24 hours.
David Frost and Brandon Lewis: We must find a new balance in how NI protocol is operated
To simply say it must be implemented in full does not deal with the reality that now exists
Easier said than done, though. Needs a big pork barrel to keep Sinn Fein and the DUP on side.
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Re: Brexit Consequences
Those would be the rules that Frost negotiated and endorsed.plodder wrote: ↑Mon Jul 05, 2021 7:34 amIt’s good to know that Frost doesn’t have his head in the sand and to be fair he raises a number of salient points. The idea that there needs to be a hard border somewhere or the union needs to break up, because of rules, does beg the question that perhaps the rules need looking at.shpalman wrote: ↑Sun Jul 04, 2021 6:08 pmUK-EU relations deteriorate again after ‘strange’ David Frost remarks
What remarks? These remarks:... relations between Brussels and London deteriorated again after remarks by the Brexit minister David Frost in the past 24 hours.
David Frost and Brandon Lewis: We must find a new balance in how NI protocol is operated
To simply say it must be implemented in full does not deal with the reality that now exists
Re: Brexit Consequences
..and the UK government signed up to, told the electorate it was a great deal, got voted in with a thumping majority on pretty much that basis: seems to me that the government have a mandate to enforce either that hard border somewhere, or the break up of the UnionWoodchopper wrote: ↑Mon Jul 05, 2021 7:52 amThose would be the rules that Frost negotiated and endorsed.plodder wrote: ↑Mon Jul 05, 2021 7:34 amIt’s good to know that Frost doesn’t have his head in the sand and to be fair he raises a number of salient points. The idea that there needs to be a hard border somewhere or the union needs to break up, because of rules, does beg the question that perhaps the rules need looking at.shpalman wrote: ↑Sun Jul 04, 2021 6:08 pmUK-EU relations deteriorate again after ‘strange’ David Frost remarks
What remarks? These remarks:
David Frost and Brandon Lewis: We must find a new balance in how NI protocol is operated
What they really don't have any kind of mandate for is to turn around now and say "we don't think these rules are needed y'know, let's just ignore them m'kay?"
It's not like nobody was raising these issues while negotiations were going on. I don't think it's "in the sand" where I'd be suggesting Frost has his head
Re: Brexit Consequences
It's almost as if the UK Governemt do not want to abide by the rules that they themselves negotiated because it does not suit them. The situation has not changed. The border has to be f.cking somewhere. Unless it is a reverse Schrodinger's border that is both not is the Irish sea and not on the isle of Ireland at the same f.cking time.
eta As pointed out above. This was known at the time they agreed this. f.cking c.nts.
eta As pointed out above. This was known at the time they agreed this. f.cking c.nts.
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Re: Brexit Consequences
Certainly seems like they were negotiated in bad faith, with every intention of trying to ignore them.
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Re: Brexit Consequences
I think the EU has been very generous, and also very compassionate and very smart. By agreeing to a 3-month delay, they stop the arguments from escalating during the marching season. Thus there won't be any imminent political pressure on it to give the UK a break to stop the riots which would have happened anyway getting any worse.
Re: Brexit Consequences
Yes, Frost is essentially admitting that the UK has behaved like complete c.nts and they will continue to do so. But now what? A softer border is still the only realistic outcome. This is a negotiation, it's normal for people to act like a..eholes when their back is against the wall.cvb wrote: ↑Mon Jul 05, 2021 10:16 amIt's almost as if the UK Governemt do not want to abide by the rules that they themselves negotiated because it does not suit them. The situation has not changed. The border has to be f.cking somewhere. Unless it is a reverse Schrodinger's border that is both not is the Irish sea and not on the isle of Ireland at the same f.cking time.
eta As pointed out above. This was known at the time they agreed this. f.cking c.nts.
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Re: Brexit Consequences
The question is whether someone can get away with being an a..eh.le. That's normal if the a..eh.le is much more powerful. Much harder if not.plodder wrote: ↑Mon Jul 05, 2021 11:55 amYes, Frost is essentially admitting that the UK has behaved like complete c.nts and they will continue to do so. But now what? A softer border is still the only realistic outcome. This is a negotiation, it's normal for people to act like a..eholes when their back is against the wall.cvb wrote: ↑Mon Jul 05, 2021 10:16 amIt's almost as if the UK Governemt do not want to abide by the rules that they themselves negotiated because it does not suit them. The situation has not changed. The border has to be f.cking somewhere. Unless it is a reverse Schrodinger's border that is both not is the Irish sea and not on the isle of Ireland at the same f.cking time.
eta As pointed out above. This was known at the time they agreed this. f.cking c.nts.
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Re: Brexit Consequences
Wrong. How many times does it need saying? There is a border, negotiated and agreed by both the EU and UK. It's between the UK mainland and the island which contains Northern Ireland. Want to renegotiate that? Go back to the table and start talking and stop whining.plodder wrote: ↑Mon Jul 05, 2021 11:55 amYes, Frost is essentially admitting that the UK has behaved like complete c.nts and they will continue to do so. But now what? A softer border is still the only realistic outcome. This is a negotiation, it's normal for people to act like a..eholes when their back is against the wall.cvb wrote: ↑Mon Jul 05, 2021 10:16 amIt's almost as if the UK Governemt do not want to abide by the rules that they themselves negotiated because it does not suit them. The situation has not changed. The border has to be f.cking somewhere. Unless it is a reverse Schrodinger's border that is both not is the Irish sea and not on the isle of Ireland at the same f.cking time.
eta As pointed out above. This was known at the time they agreed this. f.cking c.nts.
Re: Brexit Consequences
Right, and that's exactly what's being played out right now - both parties are testing out the other's relative strength. The EU is obviously considerably more powerful in normal circumstances, but the morass and fragility of NI politics means that there's far less scope for flexing of muscles. The EU, for example, are not going to install or beef up Irish border infrastructure, which they would cheerfully do for any of their other land borders.Woodchopper wrote: ↑Mon Jul 05, 2021 12:04 pmThe question is whether someone can get away with being an a..eh.le. That's normal if the a..eh.le is much more powerful. Much harder if not.plodder wrote: ↑Mon Jul 05, 2021 11:55 amYes, Frost is essentially admitting that the UK has behaved like complete c.nts and they will continue to do so. But now what? A softer border is still the only realistic outcome. This is a negotiation, it's normal for people to act like a..eholes when their back is against the wall.cvb wrote: ↑Mon Jul 05, 2021 10:16 amIt's almost as if the UK Governemt do not want to abide by the rules that they themselves negotiated because it does not suit them. The situation has not changed. The border has to be f.cking somewhere. Unless it is a reverse Schrodinger's border that is both not is the Irish sea and not on the isle of Ireland at the same f.cking time.
eta As pointed out above. This was known at the time they agreed this. f.cking c.nts.
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Re: Brexit Consequences
I agree that a powerplay is being played out in slow motion. But I don't think it'll come down to border posts in NI. The question for the EU is whether its willing to introduce tariffs on UK products (which would lead to the UK retaliating). The EU would ultimately win, but is it worth the hassle?plodder wrote: ↑Mon Jul 05, 2021 1:31 pmRight, and that's exactly what's being played out right now - both parties are testing out the other's relative strength. The EU is obviously considerably more powerful in normal circumstances, but the morass and fragility of NI politics means that there's far less scope for flexing of muscles. The EU, for example, are not going to install or beef up Irish border infrastructure, which they would cheerfully do for any of their other land borders.Woodchopper wrote: ↑Mon Jul 05, 2021 12:04 pmThe question is whether someone can get away with being an a..eh.le. That's normal if the a..eh.le is much more powerful. Much harder if not.plodder wrote: ↑Mon Jul 05, 2021 11:55 am
Yes, Frost is essentially admitting that the UK has behaved like complete c.nts and they will continue to do so. But now what? A softer border is still the only realistic outcome. This is a negotiation, it's normal for people to act like a..eholes when their back is against the wall.
Re: Brexit Consequences
A question - given that we've shown ourselves to be completely incapable of abiding by the terms of an agreement that we were boasting about securing only a few months ago, why on earth would any other country try and work out a trade deal with us? We've shown ourselves to either entirely dishonest or completely incompetent, never of which will have people climbing over each other to work with us.
it's okay to say "I don't know"
Re: Brexit Consequences
Exactly. It's why plodder's trolling is just pointless - he's not clever or funny and he doesn't have an answer to that 'cos there isn't one.Fishnut wrote: ↑Mon Jul 05, 2021 1:59 pmA question - given that we've shown ourselves to be completely incapable of abiding by the terms of an agreement that we were boasting about securing only a few months ago, why on earth would any other country try and work out a trade deal with us? We've shown ourselves to either entirely dishonest or completely incompetent, never of which will have people climbing over each other to work with us.
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Re: Brexit Consequences
Two reasons why they might. Firstly is the extent to which NI is viewed as an exceptional case which won't affect other trade relationships. Basically 'what happens in Belfast stays in Belfast'. When the Australian negotiators sit down with their UK counterparts they may assume that the UK will act differently.Fishnut wrote: ↑Mon Jul 05, 2021 1:59 pmA question - given that we've shown ourselves to be completely incapable of abiding by the terms of an agreement that we were boasting about securing only a few months ago, why on earth would any other country try and work out a trade deal with us? We've shown ourselves to either entirely dishonest or completely incompetent, never of which will have people climbing over each other to work with us.
Secondly, states renege on their agreements all the time. The UK is doing it particularly brazenly, but it doesn't have the nickname perfidious Albion for nothing. trade agreements include clauses on disputes and what happens if one party doesn't fulfill its side of the bargain (eg raising tariffs again). That's not to say that UK actions are cost free. Trade agreements will take longer if other parties try to get everything spelled out in detail, and other states may be unwilling to open up some sectors of their economies.