Brexit Consequences

[Gfamily]

if you keep not reading them then I won't bother replying to your requests any more.

You opened this discussion with me with the un-referenced argument 'don't be a f.cking idiot!' when referring to shortages in western europe. I've documented logistics problems and shortages extensively so far and you've not acknowledged any of it.

feel free to not bother replying -

You gave historic posts about "the threat" of driver shortages elsewhere - did they arise?

Yes, read the sources. Poland alone has 120,000 driver vacancies unfilled

Linky appeciated - as would evidence of (recently developing) basic food/provision shortages in Poland

[Millennie Al]

whatever batshit route the Brexit lot are taking on their journey to common sense.

I'm afraid they're going in the opposite direction.

[sheldrake]

Linky appeciated - as would evidence of (recently developing) basic food/provision shortages in Poland

The link was already posted. Links about supermarket shortages in western europe were already posted. Poland's been experiencing periodic supermarket shortages since covid lockdowns began.

[Gfamily]

Linky appeciated - as would evidence of (recently developing) basic food/provision shortages in Poland

The link was already posted. Links about supermarket shortages in western europe were already posted.

Just post the link

[sheldrake]

Linky appeciated - as would evidence of (recently developing) basic food/provision shortages in Poland

The link was already posted. Links about supermarket shortages in western europe were already posted.

Just post the link

Nope. Go back and read every link I've already posted.

[Gfamily]

The link was already posted. Links about supermarket shortages in western europe were already posted.

Just post the link

Nope. Go back and read every link I've already posted.

pfft, if you're not bothered to argue your case, I'm not going to chase the case

[sheldrake]

If you don't bother reading things the first time they're posted before you reply, I've no reason to believe you will the second time, and it just creates pointless little bits of extra work for me to keep reposting stuff.

[shpalman]

f.ck's sake. The link was this one.

... It talks quite generally about supply problems, it isn't limited to semiconductors. Here's another article, from a liberal-leaning source, pointing out shortages in western europe https://www.huffingtonpost.co.uk/entry/ ... a4cbcd70b3

You'll notice that it leads with "Food shortages in the UK are becoming a pressing concern..." and tries to argue that it's not just because of the lack of HGV drivers because "... Poland, an EU member state, actually has more vacancies at 120,000. Other European nations – including France, Italy, Spain, Germany and Denmark – are suffering, too."

The implication, however, is that even though these other countries might be short of drivers, they aren't having actual problems with food shortages. Of course it might only have mentioned "Food shortages in the UK..." since it's a UK-based article, and maybe other countries have their own articles about food shortages, except they don't, because they aren't having them.

For what it's worth a trainee journalist went to a few supermarkets in Lincoln: https://www.lincolnshirelive.co.uk/news ... at-5958759

[plodder]

It’s a multi factor problem, of course, and there are driver shortages in many countries. What the actual data shows is a shortfall of about 14,000 EU lorry drivers in the UK since lockdown ended, presumably for a number of reasons - some of which will likely be related to Brexit. This is essentially a repeat of a post I made yesterday evening.

[plodder]

presumably this policy change is related:

https://www.theguardian.com/business/20 ... rker-visas

[shpalman]

... and that's a repeat post of this, which is why we got onto the subject in the first place.

Ministers are poised to agree that this particular Brexit "benefit" was a load of f.cking bollocks

[plodder]

... and that's a repeat post of this, which is why we got onto the subject in the first place.

Ministers are poised to agree that this particular Brexit "benefit" was a load of f.cking bollocks

I don't think you've got a leg to stand on. It's all explained here: https://www.theguardian.com/business/20 ... rker-visas

[shpalman]

Ha so for balance I tried searching something like "mancanza cibo supermercato 2021" but "mancanza cibo" wants to autocomplete to either "gran bretagna" or "in inghilterra"... and even if I don't specify the country the stories which come up are mainly about the UK (even in Italian) although some of them are older, which just goes to show that you were warned this would happen and/or that's it been going on for at least a month.

It might be something to do with this.

The Washington Post article which says "Walk around a supermarket in the U.S. or Europe and you will see some empty shelves once more" completely by chance I suppose uses a photo of empty shelves which looks like it was taken in the UK somewhere (writing is in English, prices are in £) and it seems to be in Northwich according to the Daily Mail but this site for example has scraped the content so you can read it without having to go to the Daily Mail website even if I would find it less authoritative. Not sure why Getty owns that image in particular. Maybe it's a stock image. Or it would be if there were any stock.

But anyway I've walked around supermarkets in other countries in Europe and not seen anything like that, is my point, and you won't find an article like that with photos of empty shelves in supermarkets in mainland Europe.

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[plodder]

I checked La Monde, El Pais and Zeit and none of them have stories about food shortages. It must be the UK media just inventing stories for fun which is leading to the U-Turn on visas being needed for EU workers.

[shpalman]

What U-Turn on visas being needed for EU workers?

[plodder]

What U-Turn on visas being needed for EU workers?

it’s detailed in that adblocker link some bastard just posted up there ^^^

[shpalman]

Stagecoach blame Brexit and covid for widespread Stagecoach bus cancellations

Probably not the fault of Brexit or covid, though, just that public transport* is a pile of sh.t in your stupid f.cking joke of a country, especially outside London yes there is such a thing as outside London.

* - by "public transport" I could also mean "everything"

[bjn]

Hopefully the Home Office will be their normal useful welcoming selves and expedite the entry of those 14,000 willing EU drivers, who are obviously desperate to come back and be treated like sh.t.

Meanwhile, I can't find any petrol in West London today and I have to drive my car daily over the coming weeks for such trivial things like driving a cancer patient to hospital for treatment.

Also, there are enough sayings about the pointlessness of arguing with a fool.

[Woodchopper]

This though: https://mobile.twitter.com/taliashadwel ... 9077416960

[shpalman]

Well the alternative is that we just sit around for pages and pages of this thread going
"Brexit was bad"
"yeah"
"innit"
"yes it was!"
etc.

So I for one appreciate contributions from someone who thought it was a good idea because clearly someone voted for all that sh.t.

[sheldrake]

I checked La Monde, El Pais and Zeit and none of them have stories about food shortages. It must be the UK media just inventing stories for fun which is leading to the U-Turn on visas being needed for EU workers.

The Guardian articles you’ve posted mix in a lot of editorial keep in mind. The conservative press is delighted brexit is allowing us to unilaterally change visa rules to solve the problem in a way EU countries cannot. Yes, the world is enormously different depending on which media lens it is viewed through.

I did post coverage of shortages in other countries already, but they were from earlier in the year.

[plodder]

one of the tiny little depressing things in my life is logging in here to see a notification only to find I've been quoted by sheldrake with some inane "but I want to keep wrestling with you" b.llsh.t.

[shpalman]

I checked La Monde, El Pais and Zeit and none of them have stories about food shortages. It must be the UK media just inventing stories for fun which is leading to the U-Turn on visas being needed for EU workers.

The Guardian articles you’ve posted mix in a lot of editorial keep in mind. The conservative press is delighted brexit is allowing us to unilaterally change visa rules to solve the problem put the visa rules back to the way they were before in a way EU countries cannot don't need to. Yes, the world is enormously different depending on which media lens it is viewed through.

I did post coverage of shortages in other countries already, but they were from earlier in the year.

They were fears of shortages which didn't materialise at the time, and there aren't actually shortages now in these non-GB countries either, or else you'd be posting recent stories with photos of empty shelves which weren't obviously in Britain.

[sheldrake]

I checked La Monde, El Pais and Zeit and none of them have stories about food shortages. It must be the UK media just inventing stories for fun which is leading to the U-Turn on visas being needed for EU workers.

The Guardian articles you’ve posted mix in a lot of editorial keep in mind. The conservative press is delighted brexit is allowing us to unilaterally change visa rules to solve the problem put the visa rules back to the way they were before in a way EU countries cannot don't need to. Yes, the world is enormously different depending on which media lens it is viewed through.

I did post coverage of shortages in other countries already, but they were from earlier in the year.

They were fears of shortages which didn't materialise at the time, and there aren't actually shortages now in these non-GB countries either, or else you'd be posting recent stories with photos of empty shelves which weren't obviously in Britain.

The reuters link says 64% of german businesses were experiencing supply problems. Pictures of empty shelves dont demonstrate anything because they can be taken just before a shelf is refilled.

[shpalman]

It said "almost 64% of industrial firms complaining about shortages in materials" - this is not the same as the frozen food or meat sections of the the supermarket almost completely empty (and it certainly doesn't mean that there was 64% less material).

Although if those empty shelf photos from Britain were just issues of shelf stackers being too slow* then it would suggest there was actual panic-buying going on which I don't think has been the case with food as it is with fuel.

* - or maybe they can't get the staff either

The British situation happens to be on the TV news here now. Ha. Let me know if the BBC shows "similar scenes in (the rest of) Europe" when they report on the empty supermarkets and queues at petrol stations.