Scrutable

discovolante wrote: Thu Dec 10, 2020 12:06 am

veravista wrote: Wed Dec 09, 2020 10:07 pm Just seen the pictures on the BBC page - jesus, he's a scruffy c.nt. Can't even wear a mask properly, he's just an embarrassment. A man in a made to measure suit, just measured for someone else.

Remember when the former leader of the opposition was mocked by the former PM for having a scruffy tie.

Well, it just wasn't prime-ministerial. The British Public could never envisage somebody known to be a bit scruffy in the office of Prime Minister.

Bird on a Fire wrote: Thu Dec 10, 2020 12:51 am

discovolante wrote: Thu Dec 10, 2020 12:06 am

veravista wrote: Wed Dec 09, 2020 10:07 pm Just seen the pictures on the BBC page - jesus, he's a scruffy c.nt. Can't even wear a mask properly, he's just an embarrassment. A man in a made to measure suit, just measured for someone else.

Remember when the former leader of the opposition was mocked by the former PM for having a scruffy tie.

Well, it just wasn't prime-ministerial. The British Public could never envisage somebody known to be a bit scruffy in the office of Prime Minister.

Also wasn’t there that time when Corbyn turned up at the cenotaph on Remembrance Day looking like a burst couch which had been on a three day bender and promptly placed his wreath upside down.

The BBC covered it up naturally, but as interview after interview with former Labour red wall voters prove, you can’t have something who dishonours dead soldiers as Prime Minister.

Bird on a Fire wrote: Thu Dec 10, 2020 12:51 am

discovolante wrote: Thu Dec 10, 2020 12:06 am

veravista wrote: Wed Dec 09, 2020 10:07 pm Just seen the pictures on the BBC page - jesus, he's a scruffy c.nt. Can't even wear a mask properly, he's just an embarrassment. A man in a made to measure suit, just measured for someone else.

Remember when the former leader of the opposition was mocked by the former PM for having a scruffy tie.

Well, it just wasn't prime-ministerial. The British Public could never envisage somebody known to be a bit scruffy in the office of Prime Minister.

Different rules for a toff who went to Eton. Class politics at work.

When you’re poor, it’s scruffy.

When you’re rich, it’s eccentric.

It’s because the rich person obviously knows the rules, but the poor person maybe doesn’t.

There are lots of things which are considered trashy if you're poor, but classy if you're rich, like drinking during the day or being a "traveller".

But I'm not sure if I would consider Corbyn "poor" by UK standards.

EU Commission published no deal contingency plans: https://ec.europa.eu/commission/pressco ... ip_20_2368

See the momentum slipping that way.

shpalman wrote: Thu Dec 10, 2020 9:59 am There are lots of things which are considered trashy if you're poor, but classy if you're rich, like drinking during the day or being a "traveller".

But I'm not sure if I would consider Corbyn "poor" by UK standards.

course he's not, but it's all about perceptions. Corbyn's jumper and allotment are every bit as calculated as Johnson's hairdo.

Woodchopper wrote: Thu Dec 10, 2020 10:19 am EU Commission published no deal contingency plans: https://ec.europa.eu/commission/pressco ... ip_20_2368

See the momentum slipping that way.

That's not what this is. This is an extension transition period in disguise. "Temporary arrangements for 12 months for fishing" etc.

This is the fudge.

eta will be fascinated to see what this one means wrt border controls:
"Basic road connectivity: A proposal for a Regulation covering basic connectivity with regard to both road freight, and road passenger transport for 6 months, provided the UK assures the same to EU hauliers."

shpalman wrote: Thu Dec 10, 2020 9:59 am There are lots of things which are considered trashy if you're poor, but classy if you're rich, like drinking during the day or being a "traveller".

But I'm not sure if I would consider Corbyn "poor" by UK standards.

What are you talking about?! Jeremy Corbyn, socialist martyr and man of the people?? Jeremy Corbyn who fights tooth and nail to ensure no-one goes without?? Jeremy Corbyn who was raised in a country manor, attended private school and has an estimated net worth of £3m? That Jeremy Corbyn??

plodder wrote: Thu Dec 10, 2020 10:23 am

Woodchopper wrote: Thu Dec 10, 2020 10:19 am EU Commission published no deal contingency plans: https://ec.europa.eu/commission/pressco ... ip_20_2368

See the momentum slipping that way.

That's not what this is. This is an extension transition period in disguise. "Temporary arrangements for 12 months for fishing" etc.

This is the fudge.

Tell that to the exporters who now have to pay tariffs when their goods enter the EU.

Yes but there's more to No Deal than tariffs, as we all constantly remind each other.

This is no deal in name only, from the look of it.

NoDino.

headshot wrote: Thu Dec 10, 2020 10:23 am

shpalman wrote: Thu Dec 10, 2020 9:59 am There are lots of things which are considered trashy if you're poor, but classy if you're rich, like drinking during the day or being a "traveller".

But I'm not sure if I would consider Corbyn "poor" by UK standards.

What are you talking about?! Jeremy Corbyn, socialist martyr and man of the people?? Jeremy Corbyn who fights tooth and nail to ensure no-one goes without?? Jeremy Corbyn who was raised in a country manor, attended private school and has an estimated net worth of £3m? That Jeremy Corbyn??

But the house that he owns near Finsbury Park is only small!

What number last absolutely final cutoff no chance of discussing further deadline are we on now?

malbui wrote: Thu Dec 10, 2020 10:34 am What number last absolutely final cutoff no chance of discussing further deadline are we on now?

For fishing it's now Dec 31st next year!

For freight haulage and road passenger transport it's June 1st 2021.

For aviation safety and air connectivity it's June 1st 2021.

These categories are not defined in detail so could mean anything.

Brightonian wrote: Wed Dec 09, 2020 5:10 pm Let them eat cheddar.

Fascinating.

Brits could turn back to cheddar if the price of French cheese shoots up after a no-deal Brexit.

Tesco's chair John Allan told the BBC that import taxes could push up the price of brie by as much as 40%.

He said it might "change the mix of what people eat", leading to people buying more British cheddar.

And yet.
(From 2019's Cheese Category Report)

The good news keeps coming for Brexit:-

https://www.theguardian.com/politics/20 ... trade-deal

Deal finalised between Singapore and the UK which EXACTLY replicates the existing deal we had within the EU following on from the UK-Canada deal which EXACTLY replicates the existing EU-Canada deal.

At this rate it will only be a decade or two before we've eventually clawed our way back to having most of the trade agreements we already had within the EU (minus the actual EU itself obviously).

This just goes to show the genius of leaving the EU in order to recreate the exact same trade deals which were... *checks notes*... apparently intolerably bad and were killing our economy in 2016.

El Pollo Diablo wrote: Thu Dec 10, 2020 11:20 am

Cheese market share.png (30.65 KiB) Viewed 3757 times

(From 2019's Cheese Category Report)

I'm a bit thrown by the categorisation here. What about those squares of cheddar used in cheeseburgers? Surely they would fall under both Cheddar and Processed. And those packs of six triangles of Danish Blue would fall under Continental, Mini Portions and Blue. (The market shares do add up to 100.0, I just checked.) (And what the heck are Territorials???)

plodder wrote: Thu Dec 10, 2020 10:23 am

Woodchopper wrote: Thu Dec 10, 2020 10:19 am EU Commission published no deal contingency plans: https://ec.europa.eu/commission/pressco ... ip_20_2368

See the momentum slipping that way.

That's not what this is. This is an extension transition period in disguise. "Temporary arrangements for 12 months for fishing" etc.

This is the fudge.

eta will be fascinated to see what this one means wrt border controls:
"Basic road connectivity: A proposal for a Regulation covering basic connectivity with regard to both road freight, and road passenger transport for 6 months, provided the UK assures the same to EU hauliers."

You can download it here. https://ec.europa.eu/info/publications/ ... ed-kingdom

The main focus is bus travel around the border with Ireland, which should be allowed to continue. There were never going to be border controls there because of the GFA so nothing new. There's a sort of precedent in East Europe https://eur-lex.europa.eu/legal-content ... M%3Al24264

Gibraltar is specifically excluded from all measures, interestingly.

For freight, AFAICT they just delegate to the Commission the power to restore to UK hauliers the same rights the UK affords to EU ones, with the language making it pretty clear that this should be on a tit-for-tat basis.

So, basically the ball is in the UK's court in terms of how much damage it wants to inflict on itself. This very much isn't another transition period.

shpalman wrote: Thu Dec 10, 2020 7:58 am Good

link from another thread - EU has banned UK holidaymakers from January 1.

Not looking so fudgey now.

Brightonian wrote: Thu Dec 10, 2020 12:52 pm

El Pollo Diablo wrote: Thu Dec 10, 2020 11:20 am Cheese market share.png

(From 2019's Cheese Category Report)

I'm a bit thrown by the categorisation here. What about those squares of cheddar used in cheeseburgers? Surely they would fall under both Cheddar and Processed. And those packs of six triangles of Danish Blue would fall under Continental, Mini Portions and Blue. (The market shares do add up to 100.0, I just checked.) (And what the heck are Territorials???)

I’m guessing it’s the likes of Double Gloucester, Lancashire etc?

plodder wrote: Thu Dec 10, 2020 10:40 am

malbui wrote: Thu Dec 10, 2020 10:34 am What number last absolutely final cutoff no chance of discussing further deadline are we on now?

For fishing it's now Dec 31st next year!

For freight haulage and road passenger transport it's June 1st 2021.

For aviation safety and air connectivity it's June 1st 2021.

These categories are not defined in detail so could mean anything.

The draft agreement was apparently 800 pages long and covered a huge range of things including trade in goods, trade in services (including financial services), data protection (related to digital commerce), intellectual property, competition policy, mobility of key workers, energy (including nuclear), police cooperation, UK participation in EU programmes etc

How many of those 800 pages are covered by fish, road haulage and aviation safety? I'd be surprised if its more than 10%.

Brightonian wrote: Thu Dec 10, 2020 12:52 pm

El Pollo Diablo wrote: Thu Dec 10, 2020 11:20 am Cheese market share.png

(From 2019's Cheese Category Report)

I'm a bit thrown by the categorisation here. What about those squares of cheddar used in cheeseburgers? Surely they would fall under both Cheddar and Processed.

No. The slices are either presliced block cheddar, which is just cheddar; similar but for other block cheese; or processed cheese in slices; or Kraft Cheese Food, which isn't cheese.

Woodchopper wrote: Thu Dec 10, 2020 1:57 pm

plodder wrote: Thu Dec 10, 2020 10:40 am

malbui wrote: Thu Dec 10, 2020 10:34 am What number last absolutely final cutoff no chance of discussing further deadline are we on now?

For fishing it's now Dec 31st next year!

For freight haulage and road passenger transport it's June 1st 2021.

For aviation safety and air connectivity it's June 1st 2021.

These categories are not defined in detail so could mean anything.

The draft agreement was apparently 800 pages long and covered a huge range of things including trade in goods, trade in services (including financial services), data protection (related to digital commerce), intellectual property, competition policy, mobility of key workers, energy (including nuclear), police cooperation, UK participation in EU programmes etc

How many of those 800 pages are covered by fish, road haulage and aviation safety? I'd be surprised if its more than 10%.

Full document here: https://ec.europa.eu/info/sites/info/fi ... rt1_v2.pdf

12 pages, replaces circa 800.

The Garden of England, 2021.