Scrutable

plodder wrote: Sat Nov 20, 2021 5:30 pm £20M won’t get you much of a deepwater quay, by the way

Yeah, I assume thats just a contribution and they'll need to raise investment from the private sector.

sheldrake wrote: Sat Nov 20, 2021 4:44 pm

Woodchopper wrote: Sat Nov 20, 2021 4:38 pm

sheldrake wrote: Sat Nov 20, 2021 4:22 pm A new free port opened in Teeside https://www.gov.uk/government/news/tees ... r-business

How is this a benefit of Brexit? Freeports have existed in the UK since the 1980s.

As an EU member You cant create new ones without the approval of the EU commission so even if allowed the whole process would’ve taken much longer and probably involved some horse trading. This is state aid.

Ok so the benefit is that it was set up quicker. I assume that there may be some more flexibility in the tax arrangements as well.

We’ll have to see whether the free port actually creates jobs that wouldn’t have existed anyway. The government shut the earlier ones down in 2012 as they weren’t viewed as being successful.

Woodchopper wrote: Sat Nov 20, 2021 6:50 pm We’ll have to see whether the free port actually creates jobs that wouldn’t have existed anyway. The government shut the earlier ones down in 2012 as they weren’t viewed as being successful.

You may find this bit of Hansard interesting https://hansard.parliament.uk/commons/2 ... /Freeports

sheldrake wrote: Sat Nov 20, 2021 7:11 pm

Woodchopper wrote: Sat Nov 20, 2021 6:50 pm We’ll have to see whether the free port actually creates jobs that wouldn’t have existed anyway. The government shut the earlier ones down in 2012 as they weren’t viewed as being successful.

You may find this bit of Hansard interesting https://hansard.parliament.uk/commons/2 ... /Freeports

That’s more than a bit. Which bit of the bit?

Is Hansard a reliable record of facts ? AIUI it's a record of what politicians say and that's not usually taken a very reliable.

It names the consultancy used to project the claimed economic benefits, and says what they are. It could of course all be a ruse to divert public funds into some tory grandee’s bank account

sheldrake wrote: Sun Nov 21, 2021 10:42 am It names the consultancy used to project the claimed economic benefits, and says what they are. It could of course all be a ruse to divert public funds into some tory grandee’s bank account

sorry, what’s the point of this run around?

plodder wrote: Sun Nov 21, 2021 12:56 pm

sheldrake wrote: Sun Nov 21, 2021 10:42 am It names the consultancy used to project the claimed economic benefits, and says what they are. It could of course all be a ruse to divert public funds into some tory grandee’s bank account

sorry, what’s the point of this run around?

People were unsure whether any jobs benefits would materialise so I've given the detail of the claimed benefits and the identity of the consultancy which produced the economic report they're from. You're welcome.

New government report on Brexit benefits: https://assets.publishing.service.gov.u ... brexit.pdf

Quick scan - most of that report is very much promises of what we, apparently, now can/will do, and an awful lot is very small beer (e.g., "supercharging our Sparkling English Wine" (no pun intended)). There is very little substance there.

"We're no in charge of setting our own VAT"
...so are you going to change it? Say, to reduce VAT on gas and electricity...
"no, but we're in control, isn't that enough?"

https://twitter.com/sylviademars/status ... 6132315140

Great summary

Finally, there will be an answer to this question. The genius and paragon of virtue that is Jacob Rees-Mogg is setting his mighty intellect to this as Brexti Opportunities minister.

Suggestions that the main opportunities are for halfwitted no-marks with a 3rd rate comedy persona to personally enrich themselves at the public's expense are unpatriotic and should be harshly punished

tom p wrote: Tue Feb 08, 2022 2:54 pm Finally, there will be an answer to this question. The genius and paragon of virtue that is Jacob Rees-Mogg is setting his mighty intellect to this as Brexti Opportunities minister.

Suggestions that the main opportunities are for halfwitted no-marks with a 3rd rate comedy persona to personally enrich themselves at the public's expense are unpatriotic and should be harshly punished

According to this week's Economist, in an article "Digging deep" on diverging from EU law, Frosty, before he threw his toys out the pram, tried to recruit a Big Name to run a Brexit Opportunities Unit. But no one wanted the job. So presumably having Moggy as Brexit Opportunities Minister is some kind of second choice. He can perhaps now try re-enact the Corn Laws.

The same article also reports that the govt's current estimate (no source cited) of the benefits of the divergence of UK law from EU law is £1bn per year, down from the £33bn per year claimed by Vote Leave at the time of the referendum.

IvanV wrote: Tue Feb 08, 2022 3:09 pm
The same article also reports that the govt's current estimate (no source cited) of the benefits of the divergence of UK law from EU law is £1bn per year, down from the £33bn per year claimed by Vote Leave at the time of the referendum.

And to put that into context it is estimated we lose £155m down the back of sofas every year.

So the plus side we would have avoided spending half a decade arguing ourselves before letting the country be hijacked by a far-right cabal of chancers and lunatics but on the downside we would have to fish out ancient biros with unidentified foodstuffs on them.

So 6 of one, half-a-dozen noxious writing implements of the other.

I saw JRM being referred to as the 'Minister for BO' elsewhere online and figured he had a personal hygiene issue...

Oh well, no benefits, only opportunities... Jam tomorrow anyone?

www.gov.uk has a page about the Minister for Brexit Opportunities and Government Efficiency.

-Responsibilities


-Current role holder
The Rt Hon Jacob Rees-Mogg MP
...

TimW wrote: Wed Feb 09, 2022 9:46 am www.gov.uk has a page about the Minister for Brexit Opportunities and Government Efficiency.

-Responsibilities


-Current role holder
The Rt Hon Jacob Rees-Mogg MP
...

A bit like a 'minister without portfolio', but 'without responsibilities' in this case.

Would be better as Minister for Brexit Opportunities and Delivering Government Efficiency, and should be 'accidentally' referred to as such each time.

Gfamily wrote: Wed Feb 09, 2022 10:12 am A bit like a 'minister without portfolio', but 'without responsibilities' in this case.

Would be better as Minister for Brexit Opportunities and Delivering Government Efficiency, and should be 'accidentally' referred to as such each time.

Government Efficiency has no obvious close relationship to Brexit Opportunities.

But I can understand why including it might have helped persuade Mogg to take what otherwise is a very small job. It gives him an opportunity to close down or reduce bits of the public sector, which seems to be largely the kind of thing he would like to do.

But I can see why he'd prefer to be called the Minister for Brexit Opportunities rather than the Minister for Cuts.

IvanV wrote: Wed Feb 09, 2022 11:22 am

Gfamily wrote: Wed Feb 09, 2022 10:12 am A bit like a 'minister without portfolio', but 'without responsibilities' in this case.

Would be better as Minister for Brexit Opportunities and Delivering Government Efficiency, and should be 'accidentally' referred to as such each time.

Government Efficiency has no obvious close relationship to Brexit Opportunities.

But I can understand why including it might have helped persuade Mogg to take what otherwise is a very small job. It gives him an opportunity to close down or reduce bits of the public sector, which seems to be largely the kind of thing he would like to do.

But I can see why he'd prefer to be called the Minister for Brexit Opportunities rather than the Minister for Cuts.

Read the intended acronym

tom p wrote: Wed Feb 09, 2022 11:40 am

IvanV wrote: Wed Feb 09, 2022 11:22 am

Gfamily wrote: Wed Feb 09, 2022 10:12 am A bit like a 'minister without portfolio', but 'without responsibilities' in this case.

Would be better as Minister for Brexit Opportunities and Delivering Government Efficiency, and should be 'accidentally' referred to as such each time.

Government Efficiency has no obvious close relationship to Brexit Opportunities.

But I can understand why including it might have helped persuade Mogg to take what otherwise is a very small job. It gives him an opportunity to close down or reduce bits of the public sector, which seems to be largely the kind of thing he would like to do.

But I can see why he'd prefer to be called the Minister for Brexit Opportunities rather than the Minister for Cuts.

Read the intended acronym

It's also a Jim Hacker reference.

Woodchopper wrote: Wed Feb 09, 2022 12:48 pm

tom p wrote: Wed Feb 09, 2022 11:40 am Read the intended acronym

It's also a Jim Hacker reference.

If so, it's an inadvertent one.

Gfamily wrote: Wed Feb 09, 2022 12:55 pm

Woodchopper wrote: Wed Feb 09, 2022 12:48 pm

tom p wrote: Wed Feb 09, 2022 11:40 am Read the intended acronym

It's also a Jim Hacker reference.

If so, it's an inadvertent one.

Perhaps my memory fails me. I think there was something like a department for government efficiency. But its been a long time.

Woodchopper wrote: Wed Feb 09, 2022 1:32 pm

Gfamily wrote: Wed Feb 09, 2022 12:55 pm

Woodchopper wrote: Wed Feb 09, 2022 12:48 pm
It's also a Jim Hacker reference.

If so, it's an inadvertent one.

Perhaps my memory fails me. I think there was something like a department for government efficiency. But its been a long time.

Hacker started in the Department for Administrative Affairs, which is similar.

Gfamily wrote: Wed Feb 09, 2022 1:36 pm

Woodchopper wrote: Wed Feb 09, 2022 1:32 pm

Gfamily wrote: Wed Feb 09, 2022 12:55 pm

If so, it's an inadvertent one.

Perhaps my memory fails me. I think there was something like a department for government efficiency. But its been a long time.

Hacker started in the Department for Administrative Affairs, which is similar.

That's right, I did a google and one character was Sir Mark Spencer, the Prime Minister's special advisor on efficiency. So I may have got them mixed up.

We can all be grateful that Rees-Mogg is looking to produce a report on the economic benefits of reintroducing Imperial measurements, which I'm sure will be just as impressive as Gove's Levelling Up report and the previous government Brexit benefits report...