Scrutable

They doesn't mean that the people involved here aren't fantasists who think it might work, though.

dyqik wrote: Wed Nov 18, 2020 12:06 am They doesn't mean that the people involved here aren't fantasists who think it might work, though.

True. Chris Hayes just said something similar; "a lot of Republicans didn't get the message that it was just supposed to be a pretend coup to soothe the president's feelings"

Trump fires top official who refuted claims of fraud.

President Trump on Tuesday fired a top Department of Homeland Security official who led the agency’s efforts to help secure the election and was vocal about tamping down unfounded claims of ballot fraud.

In a tweet, Trump fired Christopher Krebs, who headed the Cybersecurity and Infrastructure Security Agency at DHS, and led successful efforts to help state and local election offices protect their systems and to rebut misinformation.

Earlier in the day, Krebs in a tweet refuted allegations that election systems were manipulated, saying that “59 election security experts all agree, ‘in every case of which we are aware, these claims either have been unsubstantiated or are technically incoherent.’”

Krebs’ statement amounted to a debunking of Trump’s central claim that the November election was stolen.

I can see the Biden transition team having a new hire tomorrow.

dyqik wrote: Tue Nov 17, 2020 11:57 pm

EACLucifer wrote: Tue Nov 17, 2020 11:41 pm

dyqik wrote: Tue Nov 17, 2020 11:37 pm Meanwhile, the Wayne county (Detroit) board of elections is deadlocked on certifying their votes. It's a board with two Democrats and two Republicans that have to sign off on the vote totals.

If they can't decide, then it goes to the state board. Which is also 2D and 2R, with the wife of one of the Rs a plaintiff in one of the dismissed Trump campaign lawsuits.

FFS this is ridiculous. At what point can they be taken to court to order certification?

The state's deadline for certification is Dec 13th. The Federal safe harbor date by which electors need to be certified is Dec 8th.

So there's a play being made here to not certify Michigan's results, and ignore the election results there to appoint Trump electors.

They’ve relented, thankfully.

bmforre wrote: Wed Nov 18, 2020 12:54 am Trump fires top official who refuted claims of fraud.

President Trump on Tuesday fired a top Department of Homeland Security official who led the agency’s efforts to help secure the election and was vocal about tamping down unfounded claims of ballot fraud.

In a tweet, Trump fired Christopher Krebs, who headed the Cybersecurity and Infrastructure Security Agency at DHS, and led successful efforts to help state and local election offices protect their systems and to rebut misinformation.

Earlier in the day, Krebs in a tweet refuted allegations that election systems were manipulated, saying that “59 election security experts all agree, ‘in every case of which we are aware, these claims either have been unsubstantiated or are technically incoherent.’”

Krebs’ statement amounted to a debunking of Trump’s central claim that the November election was stolen.

That's the sign if a stable genius...

Also, re Michigan - that'll really piss Trump off!

Why do I get the feeling there'll be more Downfall parodies coming soon?

dyqik wrote: Tue Nov 17, 2020 11:57 pm

EACLucifer wrote: Tue Nov 17, 2020 11:41 pm

dyqik wrote: Tue Nov 17, 2020 11:37 pm Meanwhile, the Wayne county (Detroit) board of elections is deadlocked on certifying their votes. It's a board with two Democrats and two Republicans that have to sign off on the vote totals.

If they can't decide, then it goes to the state board. Which is also 2D and 2R, with the wife of one of the Rs a plaintiff in one of the dismissed Trump campaign lawsuits.

FFS this is ridiculous. At what point can they be taken to court to order certification?

The state's deadline for certification is Dec 13th. The Federal safe harbor date by which electors need to be certified is Dec 8th.

So there's a play being made here to not certify Michigan's results, and ignore the election results there to appoint Trump electors.

They have backed down and certified (unanimously): https://www.theguardian.com/us-news/202 ... -biden-win

Grumble wrote: Wed Nov 18, 2020 6:43 am

dyqik wrote: Tue Nov 17, 2020 11:57 pm

EACLucifer wrote: Tue Nov 17, 2020 11:41 pm

FFS this is ridiculous. At what point can they be taken to court to order certification?

The state's deadline for certification is Dec 13th. The Federal safe harbor date by which electors need to be certified is Dec 8th.

So there's a play being made here to not certify Michigan's results, and ignore the election results there to appoint Trump electors.

They’ve relented, thankfully.

At a rough glance, I'd guess it was a mix of the following;

Realising that the legislature did not appear to have their backs
The secretary of state making it clear the results would still be certified
Realising that while states can decide how to award their electoral votes, they have to decide before the election, and they decided on the winner of the state popular vote
The amount of people in the know who started discussing the kind of sanctions they might face re: contempt
The immense and immediate pressure of public outrage at their malarkey

Trump spokesperson saying is it's "mob rule"... I suppose that's one way to look at it...

FlammableFlower wrote: Wed Nov 18, 2020 12:51 pm Trump spokesperson saying is it's "mob rule"... I suppose that's one way to look at it...

That's the definition of democracy, I think.

Next game is whether Trump pays the money for a recount in Wisconsin. Deadline is 5pm CST.

dyqik wrote: Wed Nov 18, 2020 1:06 pm Next game is whether Trump pays the money for a recount in Wisconsin. Deadline is 5pm CST.

Yeah was wondering about that - $7.9 million for the whole of Wisconsin, isn't it? Do they have that kind of money? Considering they're touting to cover election debts already.

Cheaper if he just goes for a few counties, but then the chance of overturning the result becomes vanishingly small. I do wonder if they'd go for one or two just to make a show of it and hope that they did get one or more flipped in their favour and so could go, "Ah ha! You see, now lets just extrapolate that to everywhere we claim we've been cheated and... oh look it says we should have won..."

dyqik wrote: Wed Nov 18, 2020 1:06 pm

FlammableFlower wrote: Wed Nov 18, 2020 12:51 pm Trump spokesperson saying is it's "mob rule"... I suppose that's one way to look at it...

That's the definition of democracy, I think.

What was the saying..."by the people, for the people"?

Is Giuliani just grifting the grifters? He charges $20 grand per day and based on yesterday's performance he just seems to be ineffectually shouty with no grasp of actual law.

Vertigowooyay wrote: Wed Nov 18, 2020 1:41 pm Is Giuliani just grifting the grifters? He charges $20 grand per day and based on yesterday's performance he just seems to be ineffectually shouty with no grasp of actual law.

He provides a particular service, which does not include winning court cases.

dyqik wrote: Wed Nov 18, 2020 1:48 pm

Vertigowooyay wrote: Wed Nov 18, 2020 1:41 pm Is Giuliani just grifting the grifters? He charges $20 grand per day and based on yesterday's performance he just seems to be ineffectually shouty with no grasp of actual law.

He provides a particular service, which does not include winning court cases.

Careful, that *almost* makes him sound like Liam Neeson in Taken.

Vertigowooyay wrote: Wed Nov 18, 2020 1:52 pm

dyqik wrote: Wed Nov 18, 2020 1:48 pm

Vertigowooyay wrote: Wed Nov 18, 2020 1:41 pm Is Giuliani just grifting the grifters? He charges $20 grand per day and based on yesterday's performance he just seems to be ineffectually shouty with no grasp of actual law.

He provides a particular service, which does not include winning court cases.

Careful, that *almost* makes him sound like Liam Neeson in Taken.

I've not seen Taken. Was Liam Neeson's character was a raging alcoholic whose specialty was spreading bizarre lies on partisan media broadcasts?

dyqik wrote: Wed Nov 18, 2020 2:10 pm

Vertigowooyay wrote: Wed Nov 18, 2020 1:52 pm

dyqik wrote: Wed Nov 18, 2020 1:48 pm

He provides a particular service, which does not include winning court cases.

Careful, that *almost* makes him sound like Liam Neeson in Taken.

I've not seen Taken. Was Liam Neeson's character was a raging alcoholic whose specialty was spreading bizarre lies on partisan media broadcasts?

No, he was a man with a partic... you know what, it doesn't matter. It's not even a very good film.

No, you're thinking of Good Morning Vietnam. Liam Neeson Kills Everyone was about enabling middle aged guys to fantasize that they've still got it. See also The Equalizer. And Die Hard 2 onward. And etc.

Looks like some recounting in Wisconsin is going to happen. Trump's not given the full money, so it's probably only going to be places like Milwaukee that voted for Biden.

clicky

ETA: I was right

monkey wrote: Wed Nov 18, 2020 4:23 pm Looks like some recounting in Wisconsin is going to happen. Trump's not given the full money, so it's probably only going to be places like Milwaukee that voted for Biden.

clicky

ETA: I was right

Of course, that's exactly what SCOTUS ruled against in Bush v Gore.

something something twitter rumour Trump seizes direct control of special forces

https://twitter.com/leahmcelrath/status ... 3482853377

plodder wrote: Wed Nov 18, 2020 4:41 pm something something twitter rumour Trump seizes direct control of special forces

https://twitter.com/leahmcelrath/status ... 3482853377

Even if true you'd hope if Trump ordered them to do anything too dodgy he'd find himself looking down their gun barrels faster than you could say "Nuremberg Principles".

Little waster wrote: Wed Nov 18, 2020 5:21 pm

plodder wrote: Wed Nov 18, 2020 4:41 pm something something twitter rumour Trump seizes direct control of special forces

https://twitter.com/leahmcelrath/status ... 3482853377

Even if true you'd hope if Trump ordered them to do anything too dodgy he'd find himself looking down their gun barrels faster than you could say "Nuremberg Principles".

If true, then they would be under an acting secretary appointed over the head of a properly appointed deputy who ought to be next in line. Similar to issues with Trump's acting DHS, who has just been found to be not lawfully appointed, in turn making his orders f.cking over the DACA invalid.

Witness corroborates the despicable Senator Graham trying to pressure Georgia SOS Raffensperger into throwing out whole tranches of legitimate ballots. Screenshots below are from live blogs, so linking directly is challenging.

(From the WSJ)



(Both from CNN)

It seems Lindsey Graham was trying to get mail in votes from counties like Chatham, Fulton and DeKalb entirely thrown out, disenfranchising hundreds of thousands of Georgia's voters - especially black voters and especially Biden voters. This is Jim Crow sh.t, right here. So far, this appears to be the biggest actual election rigging story, and while it appears it was unsuccessful, the attempt, and the fact that Senator Graham was trying it in a neighbouring state to his own South Carolina - should be investigated, as should any possible effect on elections not just in Georgia but in the south in general, especially in South Carolina, and North Carolina, where we also saw police attacking a souls to the polls march and pepper spraying five year old girls in their halloween costumes, and last minute legal shenanigans about witness requirements that meant that postal voters who followed the actual rules printed on their ballot would not have their vote counted.