Brexit benefits

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sheldrake
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Re: Brexit benefits

Post by sheldrake » Fri Oct 08, 2021 6:21 am

“Chief Operating Officer of Nissan” wrote: Brexit for Nissan is a positive. We’ll take this opportunity to redefine the auto industry in the UK. In certain conditions, our competitiveness is improved. For some of the cases, it is at par. It depends on which car, but competitiveness is definitely improved in electric vehicles.

Lew Dolby
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Re: Brexit benefits

Post by Lew Dolby » Fri Oct 08, 2021 9:03 am

If the paperwork to move goods across borders isn't really onerous, what's all the fuss about sending stuff to NI all about ?
Don't wrestle with pigs. You'll only get dirty and the pig will probably enjoy it !!!

sheldrake
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Re: Brexit benefits

Post by sheldrake » Fri Oct 08, 2021 9:05 am

Lew Dolby wrote:
Fri Oct 08, 2021 9:03 am
If the paperwork to move goods across borders isn't really onerous, what's all the fuss about sending stuff to NI all about ?
It's an internal border within the UK, affecting businesses that never had to think about exporting before. The symbolic message to Northern Irish unionists that they are 'not fully part of the UK' is very unwelcome. It does need sorting out.

temptar
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Re: Brexit benefits

Post by temptar » Fri Oct 08, 2021 9:52 am

sheldrake wrote:
Fri Oct 08, 2021 9:05 am
Lew Dolby wrote:
Fri Oct 08, 2021 9:03 am
If the paperwork to move goods across borders isn't really onerous, what's all the fuss about sending stuff to NI all about ?
It's an internal border within the UK, affecting businesses that never had to think about exporting before. The symbolic message to Northern Irish unionists that they are 'not fully part of the UK' is very unwelcome. It does need sorting out.
NI women who couldn't get abortions have known that for years and so have meat importers who were doing checks at the ports for years. If it is symbolic now, why wasn't it during the foot and mouth years? Why isn't it for women getting abortions?

sheldrake
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Re: Brexit benefits

Post by sheldrake » Fri Oct 08, 2021 9:53 am

temptar wrote:
Fri Oct 08, 2021 9:52 am

NI women who couldn't get abortions have known that for years and so have meat importers who were doing checks at the ports for years. If it is symbolic now, why wasn't it during the foot and mouth years? Why isn't it for women getting abortions?
You make good points, I only know what unionists themselves have said about it in public. I don't have any personal ties to NI unionists.

plodder
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Re: Brexit benefits

Post by plodder » Fri Oct 08, 2021 10:47 am

sheldrake wrote:
Fri Oct 08, 2021 9:53 am
temptar wrote:
Fri Oct 08, 2021 9:52 am

NI women who couldn't get abortions have known that for years and so have meat importers who were doing checks at the ports for years. If it is symbolic now, why wasn't it during the foot and mouth years? Why isn't it for women getting abortions?
You make good points, I only know what unionists themselves have said about it in public. I don't have any personal ties to NI unionists.
We watch, impressed, as sheldrake discovers that politics in NI is full of lunatics.

"Hmm" he thinks to himself. "This might complicate the simple border checks we have in mind. Best get someone to look into this a little more".

sheldrake
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Re: Brexit benefits

Post by sheldrake » Fri Oct 08, 2021 10:59 am

plodder wrote:
Fri Oct 08, 2021 10:47 am

We watch, impressed, as sheldrake discovers that politics in NI is full of lunatics.

"Hmm" he thinks to himself. "This might complicate the simple border checks we have in mind. Best get someone to look into this a little more".
I do think there are solutions, and am more optimistic than you, but I've never thought of the situation in NI as a 'benefit' so I would love to debate this with you more in the consequences thread. Is that fair?

plodder
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Re: Brexit benefits

Post by plodder » Fri Oct 08, 2021 11:24 am

.

sheldrake
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Re: Brexit benefits

Post by sheldrake » Fri Oct 08, 2021 11:36 am

We can ban employers from discriminating against women who want to wear the hijab

https://www.hrw.org/news/2021/07/19/eur ... dress-work

Lew Dolby
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Re: Brexit benefits

Post by Lew Dolby » Fri Oct 08, 2021 11:54 am

sheldrake wrote:
Fri Oct 08, 2021 11:36 am
We can ban employers from discriminating against women who want to wear the hijab
But we won't. In some jobs such wear would be a safety consideration.
Don't wrestle with pigs. You'll only get dirty and the pig will probably enjoy it !!!

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Bird on a Fire
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Re: Brexit benefits

Post by Bird on a Fire » Fri Oct 08, 2021 12:07 pm

Lew Dolby wrote:
Fri Oct 08, 2021 11:54 am
sheldrake wrote:
Fri Oct 08, 2021 11:36 am
We can ban employers from discriminating against women who want to wear the hijab
But we won't. In some jobs such wear would be a safety consideration.
Such as?

I also don't think genuine safety issues would qualify as discrimination.


That said, I don't think the EU ruling means that member states have to ban face coverings etc. It just means that EU legislation doesn't always protect workers from employers' bans.

Still a disappointing ruling from the EU, though. A worker's right to religious freedom should trump a client's preference for them not to have any.
He has the grace of a swan, the wisdom of an owl, and the eye of an eagle—ladies and gentlemen, this man is for the birds!

sheldrake
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Re: Brexit benefits

Post by sheldrake » Fri Oct 08, 2021 12:09 pm

Lew Dolby wrote:
Fri Oct 08, 2021 11:54 am
sheldrake wrote:
Fri Oct 08, 2021 11:36 am
We can ban employers from discriminating against women who want to wear the hijab
But we won't. In some jobs such wear would be a safety consideration.
Some EU countries laws go beyond that. French Burka ban for example.

sheldrake
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Re: Brexit benefits

Post by sheldrake » Fri Oct 08, 2021 2:11 pm

Japan is supporting our application to join the CPTPP, a much more flexible trade association than the EU's single market or customs union

https://www.chathamhouse.org/2021/03/wh ... rt-move-uk

temptar
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Re: Brexit benefits

Post by temptar » Fri Oct 08, 2021 2:17 pm

Bird on a Fire wrote:
Fri Oct 08, 2021 12:07 pm
Lew Dolby wrote:
Fri Oct 08, 2021 11:54 am
sheldrake wrote:
Fri Oct 08, 2021 11:36 am
We can ban employers from discriminating against women who want to wear the hijab
But we won't. In some jobs such wear would be a safety consideration.
Such as?

I also don't think genuine safety issues would qualify as discrimination.


That said, I don't think the EU ruling means that member states have to ban face coverings etc. It just means that EU legislation doesn't always protect workers from employers' bans.

Still a disappointing ruling from the EU, though. A worker's right to religious freedom should trump a client's preference for them not to have any.
You know, interestingly, the generation of women who had to wear headscarves in Ireland in the past don't see scarves as anything other than repression, not freedom. And if it is indoctrinated from birth, is it truly freedom? In short, the underlying principle can be a little more complex.

That being said, I am not sure being able to ban companies from banning specific items of clothing is a benefit you will see the House of Commons apply soon given the record of your PM vis a vis veiled women.

sheldrake
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Re: Brexit benefits

Post by sheldrake » Fri Oct 08, 2021 2:25 pm

temptar wrote:
Fri Oct 08, 2021 2:17 pm
That being said, I am not sure being able to ban companies from banning specific items of clothing is a benefit you will see the House of Commons apply soon given the record of your PM vis a vis veiled women.
It would already be religious descrimination in the UK to ban people from wearing hijab except for very clear safety or security reasons https://fullfact.org/law/what-are-rules ... niqabs-uk/

temptar
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Re: Brexit benefits

Post by temptar » Fri Oct 08, 2021 2:26 pm

So you didn't need Brexit for that

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Bird on a Fire
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Re: Brexit benefits

Post by Bird on a Fire » Fri Oct 08, 2021 2:31 pm

temptar wrote:
Fri Oct 08, 2021 2:17 pm
You know, interestingly, the generation of women who had to wear headscarves in Ireland in the past don't see scarves as anything other than repression, not freedom. And if it is indoctrinated from birth, is it truly freedom? In short, the underlying principle can be a little more complex.

That being said, I am not sure being able to ban companies from banning specific items of clothing is a benefit you will see the House of Commons apply soon given the record of your PM vis a vis veiled women.
Yes, discussion of hijabs etc. is tricky because it is ultimately a debate on the existence and nature of free will.

I'm not convinced that passing laws further restricting the opportunities of women from particular ethnic backgrounds is the right way to reduce their oppression.
He has the grace of a swan, the wisdom of an owl, and the eye of an eagle—ladies and gentlemen, this man is for the birds!

temptar
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Re: Brexit benefits

Post by temptar » Fri Oct 08, 2021 2:33 pm

sheldrake wrote:
Fri Oct 08, 2021 9:53 am
temptar wrote:
Fri Oct 08, 2021 9:52 am

NI women who couldn't get abortions have known that for years and so have meat importers who were doing checks at the ports for years. If it is symbolic now, why wasn't it during the foot and mouth years? Why isn't it for women getting abortions?
You make good points, I only know what unionists themselves have said about it in public. I don't have any personal ties to NI unionists.
If you are only listening to the DUP, then you are inadequately informed.

sheldrake
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Re: Brexit benefits

Post by sheldrake » Fri Oct 08, 2021 3:04 pm

temptar wrote:
Fri Oct 08, 2021 2:33 pm
sheldrake wrote:
Fri Oct 08, 2021 9:53 am
temptar wrote:
Fri Oct 08, 2021 9:52 am

NI women who couldn't get abortions have known that for years and so have meat importers who were doing checks at the ports for years. If it is symbolic now, why wasn't it during the foot and mouth years? Why isn't it for women getting abortions?
You make good points, I only know what unionists themselves have said about it in public. I don't have any personal ties to NI unionists.
If you are only listening to the DUP, then you are inadequately informed.
Inadequately informed about what unionists are cross about, or inadequately informed about what you think they should be cross about?

sheldrake
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Re: Brexit benefits

Post by sheldrake » Fri Oct 08, 2021 4:46 pm

1000 EU financial services firms opened offices in London to make sure they had accesss to our market

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/business-56155531

plodder
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Re: Brexit benefits

Post by plodder » Fri Oct 08, 2021 6:01 pm

sheldrake wrote:
Fri Oct 08, 2021 4:46 pm
1000 EU financial services firms opened offices in London to make sure they had accesss to our market

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/business-56155531
Spam post. It’s from last February, it’s “planned to open” and it ends:

Mr Johnson said the figures indicated the importance of reaching a decision on financial services equivalence between the EU and UK.
"They suggest that financial services firms across Europe recognise London's potency as a global financial centre and want to be able to conduct business here.
"Regulatory equivalence decisions would therefore benefit businesses on both sides of the channel."

Remind me where we are with regulatory equivalence?

sheldrake
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Re: Brexit benefits

Post by sheldrake » Fri Oct 08, 2021 6:24 pm

plodder wrote:
Fri Oct 08, 2021 6:01 pm
sheldrake wrote:
Fri Oct 08, 2021 4:46 pm
1000 EU financial services firms opened offices in London to make sure they had accesss to our market

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/business-56155531
Spam post. It’s from last February, it’s “planned to open” and it ends:

Mr Johnson said the figures indicated the importance of reaching a decision on financial services equivalence between the EU and UK.
"They suggest that financial services firms across Europe recognise London's potency as a global financial centre and want to be able to conduct business here.
"Regulatory equivalence decisions would therefore benefit businesses on both sides of the channel."

Remind me where we are with regulatory equivalence?
These jobs weren't contingent on regulatory equivalence, they were EU-based firms looking to operate in the UK who had already applied for permits. Regulatory equivalence is something you'd need to operate in the London from the EU or visa versa. I don't see a problem with posting something from February if nobody has posted it before and there's no reason to believe it is false. The mention of regulatory equivalence is Johnson nudging his EU counterparts to use these permits to remind them that EU firms want to do business in the UK, too.

I did a query on the ONS 'Nomis' service for financial sector full time jobs in greater London here https://www.nomisweb.co.uk/query/asv2htm.aspx

These are the results:-

June 1996 314,723
June 1997 317,817
June 1998 315,655
June 1999 306,653
June 2000 311,120
June 2001 330,844
June 2002 317,298
June 2003 332,525
June 2004 307,600
June 2005 299,315
June 2006 309,177
June 2007 322,351
June 2008 338,211
June 2009 329,791
June 2010 319,054
June 2011 334,571
June 2012 342,881
June 2013 326,435
June 2014 321,728
June 2015 332,080
June 2016 355,138
June 2017 349,537
June 2018 345,745
June 2019 374,838
June 2020 369,260
June 2021 377,048

I think this shows increasing financial sector employment in London.

sheldrake
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Re: Brexit benefits

Post by sheldrake » Fri Oct 08, 2021 6:33 pm

And the negotiations over Northern Ireland are starting to yield a bit of fruit

https://www.theguardian.com/politics/20 ... eland-deal

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Trinucleus
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Re: Brexit benefits

Post by Trinucleus » Fri Oct 08, 2021 7:25 pm

sheldrake wrote:
Fri Oct 08, 2021 6:33 pm
And the negotiations over Northern Ireland are starting to yield a bit of fruit

https://www.theguardian.com/politics/20 ... eland-deal
Only problem is we soon won't have any sausages to sell them :D

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Bird on a Fire
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Re: Brexit benefits

Post by Bird on a Fire » Fri Oct 08, 2021 7:26 pm

Richmond Sausages are people!
He has the grace of a swan, the wisdom of an owl, and the eye of an eagle—ladies and gentlemen, this man is for the birds!

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